The Real Strength of Mutants and Masterminds

[saint_matthew]

Actually I've played Champions. I cut my teeth on it when it first came out in the early eighties.

I don't believe you. I really want to be able to, but past experience has lead me to believe that no one ever has broke out the hero system, flicked through the rules said "well these rules are clear, concise & easy to use." An then found 5 other people who said the same thing.

I want to believe you, but i just can't. Its like if i came up to you & said "luke i am your father... Also i'm santa claus."

I direct your attention to the complete lack of actual play podcasts for Champions. There's actual play podcasts of Necessary Evil, Truth n Justice, Eclipse Phase, Hackmaster, RIFTS & even Spirit of the Century... I've yet to find a podcast of actual play of a Champions game (or even about Champions games)... Even after 6 editions of the game... So when i hear people say they've played it, i call shenanigans.

I may believe you if someone ever produces a champions actual play podcast, about super heroes, but not before. An trust me when i say they don't exist: I signed up to the champions forum board specifically to ask if one existed.

As for Online games- i don't play computer games or MMOs so I can't really complain. I considered playing City of Heroes, but they didn't have a winged character option (I was big in my Moonwing writing phase then) so I never got into it.

Yep. I came to a similiar realization a few months back; there has never ever been a successful, off-line super hero game. There have been a whole heap of comic book games, some tie in games, but not a single original super hero game, that one could consider successful.

I actually came up with the basic idea for an original super hero sandbox game & posted some notes on my deviantart account about how it would run. Feel free to take a gander if you are interested, i always enjoy feedback from different sorts of gamers.

General Concept: http://matthew-lane.deviantart.com/jour ... -317053371

Play Features: http://matthew-lane.deviantart.com/jour ... -323275506

[cobalt-blue]

Actually I've played Champions. I cut my teeth on it when it first came out in the early eighties.

I don't believe you. I really want to be able to, but past experience has lead me to believe that no one ever has broke out the hero system, flicked through the rules said "well these rules are clear, concise & easy to use." An then found 5 other people who said the same thing.

Never said it was easy to read and clear and concise. And I had to use some serious strong arm tactics to get them to play. Actually, I had to make them play a broken system first....

Uh, what's a podcast?

[saint_matthew]

Never said it was easy to read and clear and concise. And I had to use some serious strong arm tactics to get them to play. Actually, I had to make them play a broken system first....

Don't tell me; you made them play Palladium

Uh, what's a podcast?

Seriously? Or is this a failed attempt at sarcasm, i'm somehow missing the context for?

Um, its a internet radio show. For example: http://gamershavenpodcast.com/category/ ... ty-united/

[cobalt-blue]

*grin* Yep.


No, actually, I didn't know what a pod cast was. Not something I ever had an interest in following I guess.

[mirilion]

Speaking as a GM here. I tried M&M only once, and liked it a lot. Players can create a concept they want, and then sit together and force the game mechanics to fit it, including features and quirks to round eveything out.

Then I can create scenes and stories without worrying about loot, "filler" encounters, enemy statistics and everything else that isn't story and imagination. A couple of notes are enough for important challenges, including setting the atmosphere, and I'm ready.

Battles are epic, everybody is being creative with power stunts, I hand out hero points like crazy to represent enemies being awesome, and eveything is over QUICKLY. I had trouble believing how SHORT M&M action scenes can be. With my players being very creative and talented, I practically HAVE to hand out hero points just to make the villain last longer, which makes everyone even more badass and amazing.

10/10 fun rating. Still, most of the players I know are used to D&D, with its detailed tactics, equipment, loot, spells, classes and everything else, so bringing the system to life for them can be difficult.

[Cinder]

Actually I've played Champions. I cut my teeth on it when it first came out in the early eighties.

I don't believe you. I really want to be able to, but past experience has lead me to believe that no one ever has broke out the hero system, flicked through the rules said "well these rules are clear, concise & easy to use." An then found 5 other people who said the same thing.

I want to believe you, but i just can't. Its like if i came up to you & said "luke i am your father... Also i'm santa claus."

Maybe I am missing your attempt at sarcasm, because I have played Champions. My guy was a rich dude who solved crime and fought with a cane and a gun. I did not enjoy it as much as the group I played with, but it is playable IMO.

[Mr Mole]

My theory has always been that no one ever, anywhere has ever played Champions. Its one of those games people buy & then pretend to play, so they can look all smart.

While I wholeheartedly understand your skepticism, there are those of us who've actually played Champions... Although, in all honesty, I've spent a lot more time setting up Champions campaigns than actually playing them... Finding even a handful of people to play that system can be the most difficult part... Then, of course, someone comes up with a perfectly valid concept that Champions does not handle well... And there are quite a few... The Hero System is about 99% universal... But that leftover 1% can really jam things up...

Also, while I understand that people generally don't do math, there are some of us who can handle Champions without getting a brain cramp... Although scratch paper and a pocket calculator helps considerably...

Agreed with you on pretty much all points. What's EABA?

It's a system created by Greg Porter and published by BTRC... Very engineer-oriented... There's a free, lite version available at RPGNow (http://www.rpgnow.com/product/1083/EABA-v1.1?it=1), as well as a $13 paid version... Lots of supplements and tie-ins... It's not the system for everyone... But then, what is...?

[Flying Cobra]

I actually had a couple of Champions campaigns back in the late 80s/90s, as well as playing it at Cons. Never had a problem with the math. There were more people I knew who played that than DCHeroes or Villains and Vigilantes (though I ran both of those, as well, trying to convert people to DCH). No one had any interest in FASERIP, though.

Everyone I still know who played those systems agree that MnM, especially 3e, is far better than any of them ever were.