Taliesin's builds: 3E moved to sister thread

[JackGiantkiller]

if I may ask...why do you have Mighty 5 on him? I was under the impression one only had to buy multiple levels of Mighty on a ranged attack, not on a melee attack.

Taliesin has bought Mighty 5 so that the penetrating extra applies to all of Wolverine's damage (including the damage from strength). Otherwise, it would only apply based on his strike ranks. Also, you probably can skip quoting the entire character build- that takes up a lot of space.

I buy additional Penetrating extras for the same reason. In this case, with only mighty five, he actually hasn't paid for one level of Penetrating on the Strike, if this is the reasoning. Strike 2, Penetrating. One level of Mighty allows str to add to strike. The other four, in this case, are standing in for four ranks of Penetrating on the Strength...which means he has one level of str that isn't Penetrating.

[Elric]

I buy additional Penetrating extras for the same reason. In this case, with only mighty five, he actually hasn't paid for one level of Penetrating on the Strike, if this is the reasoning. Strike 2, Penetrating. One level of Mighty allows str to add to strike. The other four, in this case, are standing in for four ranks of Penetrating on the Strength...which means he has one level of str that isn't Penetrating.

No, you don't need the additional rank to make it apply at all in the case of an extra. As Penetrating is a (+1) extra on melee damage, the relevant comparison is to applying Mighty to a Range: ranged damage effect (Range- Ranged being also a +1 extra).

From Ultimate Power:

For a normal range Damage effect, each rank of Mighty allows 1 point of Strength damage bonus to stack with the effect.

So 5 points is indeed sufficient for his 5 strength bonus.

[JackGiantkiller]

Sure. 1 level of the feat allows 1 point of str bonus to stack with the effect. But there are two effects, here, aren't there? One damage, requiring one level of mighty, and one pentrating extra, requiring 5 levels of might to make that effect work.

Note that as i do not have UP, I may be misunderstanding what you are saying.


eidt:Aha. I see what you are saying. Ranged damage is 2/rank, and requiores one rank of might per rank of str, so since penetrating damage iis 2/rank, it too only requires 1 rank of mighty per str bonus. Thanks.

[Taliesin]

To be fair, I'm simply treating other Extras the same as Ranged for the purposes of multiple Mighty ranks.

Officially, the multiple Mighty ranks only apply to Ranged, but I don't see the reasoning for paying a premium on other Extras (even if it's 1pp) compared to Ranged. Ideally, it's probably better to go with the RAW, in which case, Wolvie's claws should be:

Strike 2 (Extra: Penetrating 7 [+1]; Power Feats: Improved Critical, Mighty; 11pp)

If his claws were instead a Mighty Blast, then it would only cost 10pp, even though both are simply Damage with an Extra tacked on.

So, yeah, it's kind of a house rule for me to extend the Mighty ranks to all Extras, not just to Ranged.

[Taliesin]

Anyone up for a game of “Hot Mjolnir”?

Thor

Power Level: 15 (241pp)

Abilities: STR: 32 [40] (+15), DEX: 12 (+1), CON: 36 (+13), INT: 12 (+1), WIS: 14 (+2), CHA: 18 (+4)

Skills: Diplomacy 8 (+12), Intimidate 12 (+16), Knowledge [Arcane Lore] 8 (+9), Knowledge [Tactics] 12 (+13), Languages 1 (English; base: Old Norse), Ride 8 (+10), Survival 7 (+9)

Feats: All-Out Attack, Attack Specialization [Warhammer], Benefit (Status: Asgardian God and Son of Odin), Fearless, Inspire, Power Attack, Startle, Takedown Attack

Powers:
Density 4 (Extra: Continuous [+1]; Flaw: Permanent [-1]; Power Feat: Innate; 13pp)
Device 1 “Gauntlets of Might” (Hard to Lose; 4pp)
Device 10 "Mjolnir" [Magic] (Hard to Lose; Power Feats: Indestructible, Restricted 2 [requires “worthiness” to lift and use]; Drawback: Power Surge [when Extra Effort is used; Common, Major]; 39pp)
Immunity 7 (Aging, Disease, Environmental Conditions 3 [cold, heat, and radiation], Poison, Starvation and Thirst; 7pp)
Impervious Toughness 8 (8pp)
Super-Senses 2 (Normal Sight 2 [Counters Illusion]; 2pp)
Super-Strength 4 (Heavy Load: 100 tons; 8pp)
Weather Control 6 (Mix-and-Match Environments 4pp/rank; 250 ft. radius; Distraction, Hamper Movement, and Reduced Visibility; 24pp)

Density Effects
Strength +8, Impervious Protection 2, Immovable 1, Super-Strength 1, Mass x3

Devices:

Gauntlets of Might (5pp total)
Immunity 5 (effects with Aura Extra; 5pp)

Mjolnir (50pp total)
Blast 3 [Bludgeoning] (Power Feat: Affects Insubstantial, Mighty 15; 22pp)
AP: Deflect 11 (any energy attack; Extra: Reflection [+1]; 1pp)
AP: Flight 11 (25,000 MPH; 1pp)
AP: Super-Movement 2 (Dimensional Travel 2 [adjacent dimensions]; Extras: Attack [+1], Portal [+2]; 1pp)
Immunity 3 (Environmental Conditions [vacuum], Suffocation [no need to breathe]; 3pp)
Space Travel 1 (1pp)
Super-Senses 2 (Detect Magic 2 [mental, Ranged]; 2pp)
Weather Control 4 [10] (4pp/rank; 1 mile radius; 16pp)
AP: Blast 19 [Lightning] (Power Feats: Indirect 2; 1pp)
AP: Dazzle 13 (Auditory and Visual; 1pp)
AP: Drain Constitution 20 [Anti-Force] (Extra: Ranged [+1]; 1pp)

Combat: Attack +10 / +12 (Warhammer); Damage +15 (Unarmed) / +18 (Mjolnir) / +19 (Lightning Blast); Defense +12 (+6 flat-footed); Initiative +1

Saves: Toughness +15 (+10 Impervious), Fortitude +17, Reflex +5, Will +8

Drawbacks:
Involuntary Transformation (into Normal Identity when separated from Mjolnir for longer than a minute; Uncommon, Irresistible; -4pp)
Normal Identity (Donald Blake, must strike Mjolnir on ground to become Thor; Common [full action], Major; -4pp)

Abilities 64 + Skills 14 (56 ranks) + Feats 8 + Powers 105 + Combat 44 + Saves 14 – Drawbacks 8 = Total 241

Complications: Enemy (Loki), Honor, Responsibility (to Asgard), Rivalry (Hercules)

Thor makes liberal use of All-Out Attack, eschewing defense for attack, as few things can actually harm him. This can increase his attack bonus to +17 and make him effectively PL 17.5 offensively.

Thor is identified mainly by Mjolnir, a mallet made from indestructible uru metal. I consider it Hard to Lose, since Thor can recall Mjolnir to his grasp at will. Thor can control the weather without using Mjolnir, accessing a rank 6 (24pp) array, but the hammer adds four ranks (16pp) to the array. He can also use this array to generate dazzling light, blasts of lightning, or god-slaying anti-force. A separate array within Mjolnir consists of those powers activated by physically striking with the hammer for a bludgeoning Blast or by spinning Mjolnir, to generate Deflect, Flight, or open a dimensional portal. Mjolnir has the Power Surge drawback, and without his Gauntlets of Might, Thor would suffer damage from Mjolnir whenever he uses Extra Effort on one of Mjolnir’s powers.

Whether by choice or when separated from Mjolnir, Thor reverts to his mortal vessel, usually Donald Blake:

Donald Blake (Normal Identity)

Abilities: STR: 10 (+0), DEX: 8 (-1), CON: 10 (+0), INT: 12 (+1), WIS: 14 (+2), CHA: 12 (+1)

Skills: Knowledge [Life Sciences] 8 (+9), Medicine 12 (+14), Profession [Physician] 12 (+14)

Combat: Attack +0; Damage +0 (Unarmed); Defense +0 (+0 flat-footed); Initiative -1

Saves: Toughness +0, Fortitude +2, Reflex +1, Will +6

Thor has several items that he uses rarely or does not currently use. Armed with these devices, Thor registers as a PL16 character.

This belt doubles Thor’s strength:

Device 1 “Megingjard” (Hard to Lose; Flaw: Side Effect [-5 Strength for a day when removed]; 3pp)
Traits:
Enhanced Strength 5 (5pp)

Thor wore a suit of Asgardian armor that he apparently eschews in the current run:

Device 2 “Asgardian Armor” (Hard to Lose; 8pp)
Traits:
Protection 5 (Extra: Impervious [+1]; 10pp)

Update 11/13/07 More significant changes to Thor, including divesting him of rarely-used items.

Yeah, had to get around to this guy, again, but thought I'd update him along with the other powerhouses.

[Taliesin]

It’s CLOBBERIN’ time!

The Thing

Power Level: 11 (165pp)

Abilities: STR: 30 [38] (+14), DEX: 14 (+2), CON: 34 (+12), INT: 14 (+2), WIS: 14 (+2), CHA: 14 (+2)

Skills: Craft [Mechanical] 8 (+10), Drive 8 (+10), Intimidate 12 (+14), Knowledge [Streetwise] 8 (+10), Pilot 12 (+14)

Feats: All-Out Attack, Chokehold, Environmental Adapation [zero gravity], Equipment, Improved Grab, Improved Grapple, Improved Pin, Power Attack, Startle

Powers:
Density 4 (Extra: Continuous [+1]; Flaw: Permanent [-1]; Power Feat: Innate; 13pp)
Immunity 5 (all Environmental Conditions; 5pp)
Impervious Toughness 10 (10pp)
Sensory Shield 2 (Normal Hearing; 2pp)
Super-Strength 4 (Heavy Load: 75 tons; Power Feats: Bracing, Countering Punch, Groundstrike, Super-Breath; 12pp)

Density Effects
Strength +8, Impervious Protection 2, Immovable 1, Super-Strength 1, Mass x3

Equipment: Fantasti-Flare (2ep): Light Control 1, Unstable Molecule Uniform (2ep): Commlink, GPS Receiver

Combat: Attack +8; Damage +14 (Unarmed); Defense +8 (+4 flat-footed); Initiative +2

Saves: Toughness +14 (+12 Impervious), Fortitude +14, Reflex +6, Will +6 // +4 (vs. Sensory [hearing])

Abilities 60 + Skills 12 (48 ranks) + Feats 9 + Powers 42 + Combat 32 + Saves 10 – Drawbacks 0 = Total 165

Complications: Fame (public identity)

The Thing is about as straightforward as they come. He isn’t quite as hard a hitter as the top tier powerhouses like the Hulk, but he makes up for it somewhat with greater accuracy and technique, even if it’s just brawling and grappling. Ben relies on his hard hide to protect him and uses All-Out Attack most of the time, sacrificing defense for accuracy.

Update 11/13/07 Since most of my builds are NPCs, I made this build more reflective of present day Ben Grimm. He’s still a balanced PC, though.

He's still a powerhouse, if a bit lower in PL compared to the real big boys.

[Libra]

As I may have said before, it's always interesting to see updates on old builds.

[JackGiantkiller]

Very cool Thor build...and I see your reasoning with the Pen thing...i just didn't know.

One more question, though: What if you had a Penetrating, Ranged Attack that you wanted to be mighty? Would you then just buy mighty for twice the Str bonus?

[Taliesin]

Very cool Thor build...and I see your reasoning with the Pen thing...i just didn't know.

One more question, though: What if you had a Penetrating, Ranged Attack that you wanted to be mighty? Would you then just buy mighty for twice the Str bonus?

Yes. Officially, it applies when you have Perception Mighty Damage, but I'd extend it to any two extras on Damage. You're technically using Mighty ranks to purchase the Extras on your Str bonus.

[JackGiantkiller]

And done your way, it ends up costing about one pp less. That's cool.

[Knightsfyre]

Taliesin, any plans to expand your collection of Legion of Super-Heroes builds?

I'm working on developing an LSH setting that incorporates element from all the various takes on the 30th century heroes, and your builds have been a great source.

I posted a topic on this recently where I asked for LSH build from those I consider the "big guns" on this board, including you:

http://www.atomicthinktank.com/viewtopic.php?t=26091

Since it's quickly getting buried, I thought I might go the direct approach and ask you on your own thread.

Any assistance you might provide would be extremely well received.

Thanks!

[Taliesin]

Probably in the near future, but most of my builds have been the most recent reboot. I haven't done many builds of previous versions of the LSH, which most of your requests happen to fall under, but I might do so at some time.

[Knightsfyre]

That's cool.

I'd love to see your versions of Sun Boy, Star By, Element Lad, and/or Light Lass from the current version.

The great thing about the game concept I have in mind (at least to me) is that the various versions can mix freely. It's looking more and more like I'll lean heavily on the current version alongside the "classic" Legion (pre-Crisis on Infinite Earths), so the builds you've already written up have definitely come in handy.

Of course, if you're up for a challenge and you feel like tackling clasic characters like Blok or Dawnstar, please do!

Thanks!!

[Taliesin]

Hehehe…Your body is one I would feel at home with!

Eddie

Power Level: 10 (162pp)

Abilities: STR: 10 (+0), DEX: 14 (+2), CON: -- (--), INT: 16 (+3), WIS: 14 (+2), CHA: 10 (+0)

Skills: Acrobatics 4 (+6), Intimidate 12 (+12), Notice 8 (+10), Search 8 (+11), Stealth 12 (+14)

Feats: Ambidexterity, Defensive Roll 3, Elusive Target, Evasion, Fearless, Fearsome Presence 6, Improved Trip, Sneak Attack, Startle

Powers:
Additional Limbs 2 [Shadow] (Extra: Projection [+1]; 4pp)
Blast 5 [Shadow] (Power Feat: Indirect 2; 12pp) Invite Hell
AP: Deflect 6 (energy attacks; Extra: Reflection [+1]; 1pp) Drunkard Shade
AP: Possession 4 (Extra: Continuous [+1]; Flaw: Feedback [-1]; 1pp)
AP: Strike 6 (Extra: Autofire [+1]; 1pp)
Elongation 2 [Shadow] (Extra: Projection [+1]; Flaw: Limited [to Additional Limbs; -1]; 2pp)
Flight 2 (25 MPH; Drawback: Power Loss [if wings immobilized; Uncommon, Minor]; 3pp)
Immunity 30 (Fortitude effects; 30pp)
Protection 3 (3pp)
Summon Shadow 6 (Power Feat: Mental Link; 13pp) Eddie Shoukan
Transmit 2 (shadows; 2pp) Break the Law

Combat: Attack +12; Damage +5 (Dark Blast, Indirect 2) / +6 (Shadow Strike) // +2 (Sneak Attack); Defense +14 (+7 flat-footed); Initiative +2

Saves: Toughness +6 (+3 flat-footed), Fortitude --, Reflex +6, Will +6

Optional Traits:
Feats: Challenge (Instant Block) (1pp)
Impervious Toughness 6 (Flaw: Tension [-1]; 3pp) Faultless Defense
Leaping 1 (Power Feat: Zigzag; 2pp)
AP [Blast]: Blast 5 (Extra: Autofire [+1]; Flaw: Force Break [-1]; Power Feat: Indirect 2; 1pp) Drill Special
AP [Blast]: Healing 6 (Extras: Action [Standard; +1], Perception [+2]; Flaw: Force Break [-1], Limited [to Shadow; -1], Limited to Others [-1]; 1pp) Exhaustion
AP [Blast]: Strike 6 (Extras: Area [Line; +1], Secondary Effect [+1]; Flaw: Overdrive [-1]; 1pp) Executor X
AP [Blast]: Strike 8 (Extras: Area [Cylinder; +1], Secondary Effect [+1]; Flaw: Overdrive [-1]; 1pp) Amorphous
AP [Blast]: Strike 12 (Extra: Alternate Save [Fortitude; +1]; Flaw: Instant Kill [-1]; 1pp) Black in Mind

Abilities 4 + Skills 11 (44 ranks) + Feats 16 + Powers 71 + Combat 52 + Saves 8 – Drawbacks 0 = Total 162 (+ Optional 11)

Complications: Enemy (Millia Rage), Obsession (finding a new host)

Eddie was originally the shadowy minion of the Assassin’s Guild’s leader, Zato-1, but he killed Zato-1 and is using his former master’s body as his host. Eddie has several shadow-related powers and his shadow appendages are impervious to harm. He can also summon a little Eddie or shadow to assist him in battle.

Shadow (Minion Rank 6)

Power Level: 6 (90pp)

Abilities: STR: 18 (+4), DEX: 14 (+2), CON: -- (--), INT: 10 (+0), WIS: 10 (+0), CHA: 10 (+0)

Feats: Set-Up, Sneak Attack, Teamwork

Powers:
Concealment 4 (Visual; Flaw: Limited [only in shadows; -1]; 4pp)
Elongation 3 (3pp)
Immunity 30 (Fortitude effects; 30pp)
Protection 4 (4pp)
Snare 4 (Extra: Engulf [+0]; 8pp)
AP: Trip 4 (Extra: Knockback [+1]; 1pp)
Super-Movement 1 (Slithering; 2pp)

Combat: Attack +6; Damage +4 (Unarmed) // +2 (Sneak Attack); Defense +8 (+4 flat-footed); Initiative +2

Saves: Toughness +4, Fortitude --, Reflex +5, Will +2

Abilities 2 + Skills 0 (0 ranks) + Feats 3 + Powers 52 + Combat 28 + Saves 5 – Drawbacks 0 = Total 90

[luketheduke86]

EDDIE! the only fighting character out of any game with that name that i like. Wow he is quite a beast...great build Tal!!

oh one question what is the Flaw: Instant Death on his Black in Mind move?