Mutants & Masterminds
HQ    ABOUT M&M    SUPER-VISION    GIMMICK'S GADGETS    M&M SUPERLINK    ATOMIC THINK TANK    M&M SHOP
Saving the world, one d20 roll at a time

Jab's He-Builds: Beast Man, Trap Jaw, Two-Bad, Bow

Please, tell us about your character! This section is custom-made just for your heroes (or villains) to hang out in and strut their stuff.

Moderators: The Mod Squad, The Justice League, M&M Line Developer

Re: Jab's Builds: Avatar Builds Done, Serpent Society Re-Dos

Postby Gazman » Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:00 pm

This seems like a really interesting series. You must really love jobbers if you're willing to build a decent ass kicking fleshed out version of the Serpent Society.

I like the extra bit on how you went about expanding the loser villain version into the killer villain version and the A:EMH pic for The Rattler. Would you be willing to find newer, more fearsome pictures for the rest of the newer, more fearsome Society?
User avatar
Gazman
Zealot
Zealot
 
Posts: 1412
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:55 pm
Location: Jersey

Re: Jab's Builds: Avatar Builds Done, Serpent Society Re-Dos

Postby danelsan » Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:38 pm

I'm loving these uplifted jobbers :D

I hope you do Diamondback soon. I found her to be Cap's most interesting girlfriend (and the cutest, too. Must be the pink hair and outfit, though her recent appearances push it a little more toward purple from what I remember).

Luckily her hairstyle has changed, though. Otherwise I'd be waiting for her to break the fourth wall as much as Deadpool and to party all the time :lol:
User avatar
danelsan
Champion
Champion
 
Posts: 558
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 6:25 pm

Re: Jab's Builds: Avatar Builds Done, Serpent Society Re-Dos

Postby Jabroniville » Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:06 pm

Gazman wrote:I like the extra bit on how you went about expanding the loser villain version into the killer villain version and the A:EMH pic for The Rattler. Would you be willing to find newer, more fearsome pictures for the rest of the newer, more fearsome Society?

I don't know if such pictures exist, but I can look for some.
Jabroniville
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 7432
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:12 am

Re: Jab's Builds: Avatar Builds Done, Serpent Society Re-Dos

Postby Jabroniville » Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:21 pm

ImageImage

Even Jobbers can score a Critical Hit ONCE in a while, you see...

ROCK PYTHON (M'Gula)
Created By:
Mark Gruenwald & Kieron Dwyer
First Appearance: Captain America #341, May, 1988
Role: Jobber Villain, Gimmick Guy
PL 10 (150)
STRENGTH
6 STAMINA 6 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 2 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 2

Skills:
Athletics 2 (+8)
Deception 4 (+6)
Expertise (Criminal) 4 (+6)
Insight 2 (+4)
Intimidation 4 (+6)
Perception 3 (+5)
Ranged Combat (Throwing Eggs) 3 (+12)
Stealth 2 (+5)
Technology 2 (+4)

Advantages:
Diehard, Improved Aim, Improved Critical (Eggs) 2, Improved Smash, Power Attack, Precise Attack (Ranged/Cover), Quick Draw, Ranged Attack 5, Set-Up, Withstand Damage

Powers:
"Rock Hard Skin"
Protection 3 (Extras: Impervious 9) [12]
Immunity 2 (Heat, Pressure) [2]

"Throwing Eggs" (Flaws: Easily Removable) [24]
"Acid Eggs" Blast 8 (Extras: Secondary Effect) Linked to Weaken Toughness 6 (Extras: Ranged) (36) -- (40 points)
    AE: "Steel Ribbon Eggs" Snare 8 (Feats: Split) (25)
    AE: "Smoke Eggs" Concealment 2 (Visuals) (Extras: Attack, Area- 30ft. Cloud) (8)
    AE: "Razored Tangle-Wire Eggs" Snare 6 (18) Linked to Blast 8 (16) (34)
    AE: "Plastic Explosive Eggs" Blast 10 (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst) (30)
Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+6 Damage, DC 21)
Acid Egg +8 (+8 Ranged Damage/Secondary & +6 Weaken, DC 23 & 16)
Steel Ribbon Egg +12 (+8 Ranged Affliction, DC 18)
Razor Tangle-Wire Egg +8 (+5 Snare & +4 Ranged Damage, DC 15 & 19)
Plastic Explosive Egg +10 Area (+10 Ranged Damage, DC 25)
Initiative +3

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +11 (DC 21), Toughness +6 (+9 Skin, +5 Impervious), Fortitude +8, Will +6

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)

Total: Abilities: 70 / Skills: 26--13 / Advantages: 15 / Powers: 38 / Defenses: 14 (150)

-Rock Python's a pretty cool name, but this guy is wearing a set of purple tights with a big metal bucket on his head- not exactly the kind of things super-heroes are supposed to be afraid of. He was one of the more competent and sensical Serpents, but that doesn't go a long way with this group- whole whole theme was throwing down snares and other gadgets as an 'assist' type of guy. He's also an African wanted for crimes in his home made-up country (a South Africa stand-in with Apartheid and all that). There was a humorous incident in an X-Men annual where a small group trounces his allies while he recovers a "totem", and he triumphantly climbs the ladder, exulting over his victory. He turns around, sees the team, un-convincingly describes his powers ("Well, I fling trick snake eggs... that shoot out steel ribbon on impact"), and gladly gives up the totem rather than take an ass-kicking.

-Rock Python's gear gets a huge upgrade this time around, making him quite powerful. He's an elite fighter this time around, and he's remarkably durable.

Old Rock Python: Despite being PL 8 offensively, PL 7.5 defensively, Rock Python is fairly big and tough for a non Powerhouse-type build. With "rock-hard" skin able to let him survive long falls, bullets and fire, he's no push-over. His schtick beyond being tough is tossing out gadget-like "Throwing Eggs" of various types- running the gamut of ordinary Ranged Damage, Explosions (now just a Burst in 3e, apparently), Snares (including one with Razor-Wire, meaning it's a linked Snare/Blast at lower levels because it cuts AND ties), Acid (basically Secondary Effect adding to Blast and Weaken) and Smoke (now a Concealment Attack with flat cost instead of a Ranked Power). This makes him pretty versatile, but not overly strong at any one thing.

Image
Based on: 20-foot Constrictor native to Africa & India
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jabroniville
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 7432
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:12 am

Re: Jab's Builds: Avatar Builds Done, Serpent Society Re-Dos

Postby Jabroniville » Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:26 pm

Image
Image
Image

The latter really looks more like Slither in a way- but the "Wrist Blades" are a dead-giveaway, and fits the "Bionic Villain" theme.

BUSHMASTER (Quincy McIver)
Created By:
Mark Gruenwald & Paul Neary
First Appearance: Captain America #310, Oct, 1985
Role: Jobber Villain, The Self-Hating Freak, Weapon User
PL 10 (150)
STRENGTH 7 STAMINA 5 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 2

Skills:
Athletics 4 (+11)
Deception 4 (+6)
Expertise (Criminal) 7 (+8)
Insight 3 (+5)
Intimidation 8 (+10)
Perception 4 (+6)
Stealth 2 (+7)
Technology 2 (+3)

Advantages:
All-Out Attack, Benefit (Ambidexterity), Chokehold, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Evasion, Fast Grab, Great Endurance, Improved Critical (Grapples, Steel Fangs) 2, Improved Grab, Improved Hold, Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Move-By Action, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 5, Startle, Takedown 2

Powers:
"Steel Fangs" Strength-Damage +3 (Feats: Split) Linked to Weaken Stamina 7 (Extras: Progressive +2) [25]

"Bionic Tail"
Speed 3 (16 mph) [3]
Movement 1 (Slithering) [2]
Extra Limbs 1 [1]
Elongation 1 [1]
Protection 2 [2]

Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+7 Damage, DC 22)
Steel Fangs +10 (+10 Damage & +7 Weaken, DC 25 & 17)
Initiative +8

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 19), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +5 (+7 Bionic Tail), Fortitude +7, Will +6

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)
Secret (Self-Hatred)- Bushmaster considers himself a grotesque freak now that he's trapped with a snake's tail, and thus feels obligated to keep working for the Serpent Society, and will not betray them no matter what, even to save his friends (like Diamondback).
Weakness (Magnetism/Electricity)- As someone with multiple bionic implants, Bushmaster is much more vulnerable to electrical & magnetic attacks, which hit his metallic innards.
Prejudice (Obvious Metahuman)- Bushmaster can in no way be mistaken for a normal human being.

Total: Abilities: 64 / Skills: 34--17 / Advantages: 24 / Powers: 34 / Defenses: 11 (150)

-Bushmaster is probably the most visually recognizable member of his team, and was one of the most well-developed as a character. A common thug (and younger brother of a dead Luke Cage villain), he was turned into a bloody torso while trying to escape police capture, and Roxxon (Marvel's token Evil Big Oil company) turned him into a bionic warrior, with the promise of giving him 'normal' legs later on. Then the guys who made that promise went to jail, and he was stuck. This left him feeling like a freak of nature, and his few friends in the Serpent Society (mainly Diamondback) were his only positive. When Diamondback betrayed the team, Bushmaster went after her, feeling he couldn't turn his back on the only way he could make money, but willingly let her go on occasion to "make them even" for the time Rachel saved his life.

-Altogether, he's a pretty cool-looking villain. Creepy because he has no legs, he's got cool claws, an interesting and unique look, and he looks scary. That's about all you can ask for, especially with silly groups like this.

-An elite Bushmaster only gets a minor upgrade, mostly getting stronger and packing way more damage with his Poison.

Old Bushmaster: Bushmaster has multiple powers stemming from his bionic nature, with his key weapons being the Steel Fangs, poisonous (the more expensive in 3e "Progression" Extra) blades on his forearms that make him a PL 9 fighter. His Tail serves to make him very versatile- his reach is enhanced to 15 feet, he's tougher than normal, it counts as an Extra Limb and he can grapple effecively without using his hands (Ambidexterity plus Improved Grab plus Limbs), in addition to making him very fast and slithery. His balanced nature makes him one of the more dangerous Society members, as even at PL 9 offense, PL 8 defense, he can dish out some damage.

Image
Based on: One of the most dangerous pit vipers in South America
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Jabroniville
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 7432
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:12 am

Re: Jab's Builds: SS Re-Dos- Copperhead, Rock Python, Bushmaster

Postby Jabroniville » Mon Mar 19, 2012 10:50 pm

Image

FER-DE-LANCE (Teresa Vasquez)
Created By:
Mark Gruenwald & Tom Morgan
First Appearance: Captain America #337, Jan, 1988
Role: Jobber Villain, Weapon Girl
PL 10 (150)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA 7 AGILITY 6
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 3
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 2

Skills:
Acrobatics 6 (+12)
Athletics 2 (+10)
Deception 4 (+6)
Expertise (Criminal) 5 (+6)
Expertise (Soldier) 8 (+9)
Insight 3 (+5)
Intimidation 6 (+8)
Perception 5 (+8)
Sleight of Hand 4 (+7)
Stealth 3 (+9)
Vehicles 4 (+7)

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, Agile Feint, All-Out Attack, Chokehold, Daze (Intimidation), Diehard, Evasion, Extraordinary Effort, Improved Critical (Arm Blades) 2, Improved Initiative, Improved Smash, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Ranged Attack 6, Startle, Takedown 2

Powers:
"Fer-de-Lance Costume" (Flaws: Removable) [8]
"Omnium Steel Arm Blades" Strength-Damage +2 (Extras: Penetrating 5) (7)
"Boot Blades" Movement 1 (Wall-Crawling) (2)
-- (9 points)

"Super-Strong Enhancements" Leaping 1 [1]

Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Omnium Arm Blades +10 (+10 Damage, DC 25)
Initiative +10

Defenses:
Dodge +13 (DC 23), Parry +13 (DC 23), Toughness +7, Fortitude +8, Will +6

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)

Total: Abilities: 78 / Skills: 50--25 / Advantages: 23 / Powers: 9 / Defenses: 15 (150)

-Fer-De-Lance is more filler on her team than anything (yeah, that's right- Filler on THIS team), despite being pretty powerful- a super-strong chick with Omnium steel blades on her forearms and feet. She's only showed up a small handful of times compared to the others, as her powers are problematic (she can't slice or GUT Cap in his own book, y'know...), her costume kinda sucks, and she has no real personality beyond "chick who faked friendship with Diamondback and then betrayed her". She's just a nasty character, but not a lot of thought went into her.

-Fer-de-Lance is stronger and faster in this version, and now acts as the team's Military-based character. She's sort of a REALLY strong Scrapper as well.

Old Fer-de-Lance: Part of what I like about 3e is that they've gotten rid of the "log jam" at human to superhuman strength levels- STR 7 is now well beyond human capabilities, and so is STR 6, so "mildly super-strong" people and animals (a pretty huge list- almost any strong animal in 2nd edition would be only one notch higher than some people, and guys like Fer-De-Lance & Foxbat who didn't show EXTREME super-strength would appear to be human-level) are now easily placed above human limits, while still allowing even stronger guys (Spidey, The Rhino) to go further up the scale to differentiate from them. Fer-De-Lance is one such a character, a mildly super-strong person with +2 Steel Blades, Wall-Crawling, and some fighting capabilities. So she's tough and strong, but not overly so. Notably, she did AMAZINGLY well in my Tournaments of Suck, which I actually drew back a bit (making her PL 8 instead of PL 9)- she was never THAT effective in the comics.

Image
Based on: Common name for "lancehead" pit viper species endemic to Central America
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jabroniville
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 7432
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:12 am

Re: Jab's Builds: SS Re-Dos- Copperhead, Rock Python, Bushmaster

Postby Jabroniville » Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:07 pm

Image
Image
Image

Cold in there much, Mister Hughes?

DIAMONDBACK (Rachel Leighton)
Created By:
Mark Gruenwald & Paul Neary
First Appearance: Captain America #310, Oct, 1985
Role: Jobber Villain, Femme Fatale, Bad Girl Turned Good, Gimmick User
PL 10 (150)
STRENGTH
1 STAMINA 3 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 8 DEXTERITY 5
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Acrobatics 4 (+9)
Athletics 2 (+3)
Close Combat (Unarmed) 5 (+13)
Deception 5 (+8, +10 Attractive)
Expertise (Mercenary) 7 (+8)
Insight 5 (+8)
Investigation 4 (+7)
Perception 5 (+8)
Persuasion 2 (+5, +7 Attractive)
Ranged Combat (Throwing) 6 (+14)
Sleight of Hand 5 (+10)
Stealth 3 (+8)
Technology 2 (+3)
Vehicles 2 (+7)

Advantages:
Attractive, Connected, Defensive Attack, Defensive Roll, Equipment (Costume +1), Evasion, Grappling Finesse, Improved Aim, Improved Critical (Throwing Diamonds) 2, Improved Defense, Improved Smash, Power Attack, Precise Attack (Ranged/Cover), Quick Draw, Ranged Attack 3, Set-Up, Teamwork

Powers:
"Throwing Diamonds" (Flaws: Easily Removable) [21]
"Acid Diamonds" Blast 6 (Diminished Range -1) Linked to Weaken Toughness 6 (Extras: Affects Objects, Ranged) (D.Range -1) (28) -- (34)
    AE: "Tear Gas Diamonds" Affliction 6 (Fort; Dazed & Impaired Vision/Stunned & Vision Disabled/Incapacitated) (Extras: Ranged, Extra Condition, Area- 15ft. Cloud) (24)
    AE: "Sharp Diamonds" Strength-Damage +1 (Extras: Ranged 5, Multiattack 5) (11)
    AE: "Explosive Diamonds" Blast 7 (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst) (Diminished Range -1) (20)
    AE: "Smoke Diamonds" Concealment (Visuals) 2 (Extras: Attack, Area- 30ft. Cloud +2) (10)
    AE: "Narcotic Diamonds" Affliction 6 (Fort; Fatigued/Exhausted/Incapacitated) (Extras: Cumulative, Ranged) (18)
    AE: "Poison Diamonds" Weaken Stamina 6 (Extras: Ranged, Progressive +2) (24)
-- (42 points)

Offense:
Unarmed +13 (+1 Damage, DC 16)
Tear Gas +4 Area (+4 Ranged Affliction, DC 14)
Sharp Diamonds +14 (+2 Ranged Damage, DC 17)
Acid Diamonds +14 (+6 Ranged Damage & Weaken, DC 21 & 16)
Explosive Diamonds +5 Area (+6 Ranged Damage, DC 21)
Smoke Diamonds +4 Area (+4 Concealment, DC 14)
Narcotic Diamonds +14 (+6 Ranged Affliction, DC 16)
Poison Diamonds +14 (+6 Ranged Weaken, DC 16)
Initiative +5

Defenses:
Dodge +13 (DC 23), Parry +13 (DC 23), Toughness +3 (+4 D.Roll, +5 Costume), Fortitude +6, Will +7

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)
Relationship (Captain America)- Rachel loved, or loves, Cap, and has risked her life and career to save him several times.
Reputation (Villain & Mercenary)- Diamondback is on the wrong side of the law much of the time, and is a general mercenary the rest, so despite her SHIELD alliances, few overly trust her.
Enemy/Guilt (Snapdragon)- Snapdragon was a female mercenary who felt wronged by Rachel during their training under The Taskmaster, and hunted her down and drowned her. Though she recovered, Rachel was traumatized, and feared for her life for several months, until she went insane while under the Super-Soldier Serum's influence, and killed Snapdragon in combat. This led her towards incredible guilt, though she eventually recovered.

Total: Abilities: 58 / Skills: 58--29 / Advantages: 19 / Powers: 21 / Defenses: 22 (150)

-Everyone loves Diamondback. She was a highlight of Mark Gruenwald's eons-long run on Captain America, where this generic background villainess (who once threw the keys to a Serpent Saucer down the front of her shirt so Cap would have to feel her up to get them- Cold Fish Cap naturally guessed she wouldn't actually commit suicide, proving that his Will Save is ASTRONOMICAL in power) suddenly gets a crush on the hero, making a segueway into a full-on love affair, where Cap helps her to reform, and she desperately tries to be "good enough" for him. They had their twists and turns (getting her hair from Magenta to natural brown, her brother Cutthroat's death, Crossbones being revealed as her childhood abuser, etc.), and went the way all superhero romances with new characters go- they broke up. She's been seen off-and-on over the years like Asp & Black Mamba, sticking around the Merc-oriented titles, but had a supporting role in "The Initiative", where she hooked up with fellow villain-turned-good, The Constrictor, who promptly underwent the same "I'm not good enough for you" characterization Rachel had before. Quite interesting stuff, but sadly, the modern Cap writer Ed Brubaker hasn't brought Rachel back, favouring Cap's Old School Lady, Sharon Carter.

-Elite Diamondback is sorta like the old one, an accurate Gimmick User, though her upgrades make her suck less otherwise (Rae was never beyond PL 6 in melee). All of her Saves are boosted, though she's still highly-vulnerable, as her Skills cost quite a lost. People like Rachel really showcase the game's hampering of Skillmonkeys.

Old Diamondback: Diamondback is an effective fighter, but as a human-level person, only operates at the PL 8 boundary, being slightly over-cost. She's very skilled (48 ranks), quick, light on her feet, hard to hit (+11 is not too shabby for a PL 8), and has multiple varied weapons. Her Throwing Diamonds are all in her costume, hidden in dozens of compartments, so it's as hard to disarm as a suit of armour would be. She's got seven different types of attacks, ranging from Explosions to Blasts (Multiattack 5 in case she Power Attacks) to various Afflictions & Concealment, so she can hit areas AND individual targets quite well. The effect a lot of these Serpents have with their PL 8 status is that they're nowhere NEAR good enough to beat Cap in a fair fight (he's PL 12 by anyone's standards), so they have to gang up on him with five or six guys to even have a shot- which seems about right. But it leads to poor Rachel having to follow him on adventures when she's four PLs below him!

Image
Based on: Highly venomous rattlesnake responsible for more U.S. fatalities than any other
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jabroniville
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 7432
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:12 am

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby danelsan » Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:26 am

Yay! Powered up Diamondback, nice!
Hmm... is it just me, or does she looks slightly swivel-eyed* in the first picture?
Also, that last one is, somewhat miraculously, a pic by AH I had not seeing yet.



*(not sure if this is the correct term. My English is failing me here)
User avatar
danelsan
Champion
Champion
 
Posts: 558
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 6:25 pm

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Horsenhero » Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:11 pm

Not sure what you mean by "swivel-eyed" Danelsan, but it it refers to the fact it looks like she suffers from having a lazy eye (her left eye isn't focused straight ahead, where the right eye is), then...yeah.

I like a PL10 Diamondback, Yes I do. She makes quite the rooftop hero designed like this.

And while fanservice generally doesn't move me...the Adam Hughes pic....wow.
Horsenhero
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 10508
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:24 pm
Location: Riding the range

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby prodigyduck » Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:24 pm

Very nice Diamondback.

I had never seen that AH pic before.
"Terrorism is the tactic of the weak." -Reza Aslan, Muslim Scholar

Mediocrity always attacks excellence.

Please see my MnM Beastiary.
User avatar
prodigyduck
Mastermind
Mastermind
 
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 8:15 pm
Location: A comfortable computer chair

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Spam » Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:48 pm

It looks like he was drawing Black Cat and ran out of ink...
Not complaining, though...
Spam
Bystander
Bystander
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:34 pm

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Ares » Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:59 pm

I really wish they hadn't brought Sharon Carter back in Waid's run. She always struck me as kind of bland or as a generically angry action girl. Diamondback just had a lot more going for her in terms of personality, backstory, interaction, and it was nice that a paragon like Cap could date and love a reformed villain.
User avatar
Ares
Zealot
Zealot
 
Posts: 1329
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:41 pm

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Woodclaw » Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:21 pm

Ares wrote:I really wish they hadn't brought Sharon Carter back in Waid's run. She always struck me as kind of bland or as a generically angry action girl. Diamondback just had a lot more going for her in terms of personality, backstory, interaction, and it was nice that a paragon like Cap could date and love a reformed villain.


Same here, but for different reasons. Sharon is simply a too perfect match for Cap. I'm not saying that their relationship is without problems, but simply that hooking up Cap with a S.H.I.E.L.D. super-agent who happens to be the sister/niece/whatever of his WW2 girlfriend struck me as kind of cheap. The possible complications in the relationship are too far from the reader experience and make the characters distant, tarnishing the pathos.

In comparison, I prefer Bernie Rosenthal and Diamondback a lot more.

Bernie was a funny character and I liked the fact that she was in love with Steve Rogers, not with Cap. The part of Stern/Byrne first and later Gruenwald run when Cap lived in a old brownstone in NY, work as an inker for Marvel Comics, have a semblance of normal life instead of brooding about old glories, is among my favourite comic book moments.

Diamondback, on the other hand, was interesting for the whole boy scout/bad girl dynamic and I loved some of the awkward moments the relationship introduced (Cap's Night Out is one of my favourite stores ever).
Last edited by Woodclaw on Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Yes, it's a bloody flying alligator setting fire to my city!"

Sam Vimes (Guards! Guards!)


From a dark corner of my mind (my build's thread)
From another dark corner of my mind (my Deviantart page)
User avatar
Woodclaw
Luminary
Luminary
 
Posts: 2607
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:33 am
Location: Italia

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Horsenhero » Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:25 pm

I like Rachel and Bernie more than Sharon as well, but only because "Agent 13" is just too custom made for Cap to be in love with.

BTW- Woodclaw, I wasn't 100% certain about the mention of Gru in your piece about Bernie. She was a Stern/Byrne creation, during their days as co-writers and artist on CA.
Horsenhero
Cosmic Entity
Cosmic Entity
 
Posts: 10508
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:24 pm
Location: Riding the range

Re: Jab's Builds: Bushmaster, Fer-de-Lance, Diamondback

Postby Gazman » Tue Mar 20, 2012 8:19 pm

The top DB pic looks to me like she's rolling her eyes. "Nice floor show and other cutting remarks..."

I also like her more than Agent 13 for Cap. Even if Sharon is capable in her own right, she has that boring created solely to be a love interest shallowness to her.

Digging the pumped up Society, Jab and thanks for the new pics.
User avatar
Gazman
Zealot
Zealot
 
Posts: 1412
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:55 pm
Location: Jersey

PreviousNext

Return to Roll Call

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Beleriphon and 8 guests