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Not usable by others

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Not usable by others

Postby Calendril » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:05 pm

I'm building a piece of equipment and I don't want other characters to be able to use the special abilities. Preferably, it would activate its damage ability if someone else picked it up.

What would be the best way to write this up?
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Monolith » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:25 pm

The first thing that pops into my head is that if it can't be used by someone else it's not equipment, nor should it have the removeable flaw. It's a power built with points and a complication calling it gear of some type: Crossbow: ranged damage 8, accurate 2, 18 pts Complication: the crossbow can be disarmed and taken away occasionally.

That type of weapon is something the player seldom loses but when it's lost he gets a hero point for the complication, but the power still can't be used by someone else.

The damage aspect could be an alternate power of triggered damage that the player sets up ahead of time: damage 8, secondary effect, triggered (touched by someone other then the owner), 1 pt
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Arthur Eld » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:31 pm

I could definitely see making equipment not usable by others. Or if you want to apply it to Removable powers, you can do it that way too.

Either way, its a feature. 2E had the Power Feat Restricted for Devices just for stuff like this. One point restricted it to a small group, 2 points meant only the character in question could use it.

I mean, if you want guns with biometric locks, just call it a feature and call it a day.

The damage stuff, however, does need to be bought as a power.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Monolith » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:11 pm

I'd probably allow the 2e feats for removeable. I'd never allow it for equipment. Equipment's all ready too cheap.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Arthur Eld » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:18 pm

This isn't making equipment more cheap, its making it more effective.

Plus, how often do players get their equipment used by others, really?

After all, look at the movie Shoot em up-a lot of the mooks have pistols with thumbprint sensors. That doesn't mean they'd have to be bought as powers.

Whether or not its too cheap is not the issue at hand, the question is (I'm pretty sure) more about the mechanics of how to do such a thing. Everything else is up to individual GMs.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Monolith » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:22 pm

Part of the reason equipment's super cheap is because it can be taken away, and even used against you. Only paying 4 points for a ranged damage 8 blaster and then making it useless to others for only 1 point just screams number-cruncher to me. House rules, such as using the 2e feat, that can lead to abuse need to scrutinized.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby saint_matthew » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:40 pm

Monolith wrote:Part of the reason equipment's super cheap is because it can be taken away, and even used against you.


Um, i'm sorry but you are wrong Monolith. Sure its predicated on you not being able to use it if its taken away from you. However it has never been predicated on the idea that the cost reducation was based on it being used against you: Ever.

In fact 2E had a power stunt that allowed you to lock its usage to a person, or a blood line, or any number of other qualities. After all, look at Thor's Hammer; Mjolnir. Mjolnir could only be lifted by the worthy.

Monolith wrote:Only paying 4 points for a ranged damage 8 blaster and then making it useless to others for only 1 point just screams number-cruncher to me.


Its not useless at all. If you have a device & i take it away from you, then me not being able to use it is not useless... You can't use it & thats very useful.

I've said it before, i'll say it again: Mutants and Masterminds is not D&D. Narrative comes first, rules come second. The rules exist to make rulings for the story, not the other way round.

So if the person in question has a device that is usable only by a particular character, or a particular subset of characters, then yes it is still a device. Heck, i've done it with a villain, with a star rod like device, who accidentally went on a killing spree. No one knows what the property is that activates it, but it only works for a particualr subset of people, with a particular unknown trait.

@OP: Just add the feature extra to the device.
Last edited by saint_matthew on Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Monolith » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:44 pm

I'm talking about equipment here, not devices. The stuff people buy with equipment points. That stuff is dirt cheap and can be used by anyone. There's nothing in the 2e rules about making equipment not useable by others. That was a special feat for devices, not equipment.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby saint_matthew » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:49 pm

Monolith wrote:I'm talking about equipment here, not devices. The stuff people buy with equipment points. That stuff is dirt cheap and can be used by anyone. There's nothing in the 2e rules about making equipment not useable by others. That was a special feat for devices, not equipment.


I think you'll find the OP mispoke & he means devices, rather then equipment. After all equipment is not something that you often build.

But even so you can still add the feature extra to something to make it specialised equipment (since equipment is just more mundane version of devices). The point still stands that the cost reduction is not based on you being able to use what you've stolen from me.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Monolith » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:56 pm

The book states: Equipment is subject to damage, malfunctions, and loss, even more so than devices with the Removable flaw (see the flaw description in the Powers chapter).

That implies to me that players should expect to lose access to that equipment far more often then they do devices. Allowing that equipment to be locked to you just feels wrong to me. If you like it great. It just doesn't fit with how I feel equipment should work, because equipment isn't unique or special. It's something anyone can use. It's not just for you, and that's why it's cheap.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby saint_matthew » Sat Sep 22, 2012 7:19 pm

Okay, you seem to be using a non sequitar to connect two unrelated statements.

Monolith wrote:That implies to me that players should expect to lose access to that equipment far more often then they do devices.

[...]

Allowing that equipment to be locked to you just feels wrong to me.


Why would the lose of a particular piece of equipment, somehow invalidate the idea of a lock? These two concepts are completely seperate: One does not naturally lead to the other.

Monolith wrote:because equipment isn't unique or special.


Sometimes it is special: For instance a legion flight ring is considered equipment and not a device.
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Re: Not usable by others

Postby Earth-Two_Kenn » Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:41 pm

Biometric Scanner, a 2 pt. Feature.

As Equipment it costs 0.4 points. It is prone to failure, and might give false positives.

As Easily Removable Device, it costs 1.2 points, as Removable Device, it costs 1.6 points. Curiously, both are equally reliable, just one is easier to lose the former. Both are more reliable than the Equipment version.

As a Power with a Power Loss complication, the Feature becomes unnecessary, and the biometric scanner becomes a VERY secure special effect.

At any given moment, the game master may say "nope, that's a problem" and disallow any or all of the variants given. That's her or his right. Anything else is trying to tell someone else how to rub that someone else's campaign. Relax. If you don't like it, don't use it. If you're okay with it, do use it.
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