Avengers film [May 4, 2012]

[IronSledge]

I saw it last night and felt it was the purest distillation of Joss Whedon's style that one is likely to find. That'll work for 95% of genre fans, but as I happen to dislike his signature style, I didn't like it. I would go so far as to say I disliked it. I'll have a complete review later on in case anyone wants to hear from someone who didn't like the movie.

[Thorpacolypse]

I saw it last night and felt it was the purest distillation of Joss Whedon's style that one is likely to find. That'll work for 95% of genre fans, but as I happen to dislike his signature style, I didn't like it. I would go so far as to say I disliked it. I'll have a complete review later on in case anyone wants to hear from someone who didn't like the movie.

I will be interested to hear your thoughts. I am on the other side, but I always love to hear the differing point of view just to hear what I maybe didn't think of.

When I left the Dark Knight years back, I thought it was the greatest movie ever, but after hearing some things that people didn't like and re-watching it, I could see their point. I came to my senses and realized that Ace Ventura: Pet Detective was still the greatest movie ever.

[Unbeliever]

I'm with Iron Sledge. Really, AO Scott (NY Times) probably expresses my opinions better than I can. Which makes sense since he gets paid to do so.

I'd call it ok, say B/B+ depending on your sensibilities. Here are my feelings, in no particular order:

• I happen to not be a big Whedon fan. Some of the quips were nice breaks from the grind. Some of them were just distracting. Tony Stark, in particular, went from being generally witty in an arrogant way to a pop culture reference dispensing machine. It made him seem like he had a bizarre breed of Tourett's.
• I do not feel like this story or plot were "complex" at all. This is not a criticism at all -- simplicity is good. But, I refuse to give this movie a free pass b/c of its supposed complexity. Not only is this standard comic book fare (again, not a criticism, but the roadmap was laid out for them), but it's also standard movie fare: collect heroes, stop bad guy.
• Loki was great. I liked him pretty well in Thor, but here he came into his own more. He, in a lot of ways, stole the show. He was continually tripped up by his arrogance. Enough times that it got to be a bit repetitive in the course of one film. But, that is his character.
• Action. The first half or so of the movie had pretty solid action. The climax of the movie, while big and loud, was entirely lacking. It lacked any sort of narrative or development, and all good fight scenes have one. It, and other parts of the movie, were also dizzying to watch. Its action will remind you of the Transformers films -- rather than focusing in to see the beautiful detail on the aliens they zoom past and we're left guessing what they look like.

[Thakowsaizmu]

I'm not a huge Avengers fan, and honestly could not have given less of a crap about a few of the characters in the movie. But the movie itself, I thought, was really good. Yes, one could easily see Joss Whedon wrote it, but it was nice for a comic book movie to be written by a comic book nerd. It actually felt like a comic book, and no one in this movie sounded like he had throat cancer or was styled after Twilight. This is one of those few Supers movies that have come out recently that I am looking forward to the DVD release so I can get that too.

[Bladewind]

It was nice for a comic book movie to be written by a comic book nerd. It actually felt like a comic book.

Y'know... I think a lot of people miss that point for some bizarre reason.

[Sidious]

Three things I loved about this movie:

1. Scarlet Johansson in the Cat suit. Plus she had the best Whedon-esque lines. I wouldn't mind a Black Widow movie if he wrote and directed it.

2. Puny god. nuff said. easily the most comedic beatdown in the film.

3. the reveal after the credits. OMG the next movie is going to be awesome!!!

[Bladewind]

Three things I loved about this movie:

1. Scarlet Johansson in the Cat suit. Plus she had the best Whedon-esque lines. I wouldn't mind a Black Widow movie if he wrote and directed it.

2. Puny god. nuff said. easily the most comedic beatdown in the film.

3. the reveal after the credits. OMG the next movie is going to be awesome!!!

1. Absolutely LOVED her first appearance in the film.

2. Right up there with Thor and Hulk giving the beats together and then...

3. The murmur around me in the theatre was awesome... was that? No way? Yes it was.. Your kidding!? Nothing like comic nerds enjoying a movie.


I would also add that I truly believe that this was the best Hulk of the last three film versions. It was a great touch to actually use the actor and movement mimicking tech to have him also be the Hulk.

[Thakowsaizmu]

The end thing was awesome.

Shawarma for the win!

[Rabbitman]

Three things I loved about this movie:

1. Scarlet Johansson in the Cat suit. Plus she had the best Whedon-esque lines. I wouldn't mind a Black Widow movie if he wrote and directed it.

2. Puny god. nuff said. easily the most comedic beatdown in the film.

3. the reveal after the credits. OMG the next movie is going to be awesome!!!

1. Absolutely LOVED her first appearance in the film.

2. Right up there with Thor and Hulk giving the beats together and then...

3. The murmur around me in the theatre was awesome... was that? No way? Yes it was.. Your kidding!? Nothing like comic nerds enjoying a movie.


I would also add that I truly believe that this was the best Hulk of the last three film versions. It was a great touch to actually use the actor and movement mimicking tech to have him also be the Hulk.

1. I think Black Widow would be a great opportunity for Marvel to have the first successful Supers movie about a female protagonist, and the current cast/crew could pull it off beautifully. Apparently Scarlett wants to do a Widow movie herself, but rumours I'm hearing are that Black Widow/Hawkeye will just have supporting roles in a Samuel L. Jackson is Nick Fury movie instead.

2. Didn't actually hear the words "Puny God" on the first viewing due to the volume of laughter from the action preceding it.

3. So insanely pumped, and needless to say have been terrifying my less Marvel educated friends about things to come by lending them a certain 2-part mini-series from the early 90s...

(4.) I think it was more importantly the best Bruce Banner as well, socially awkward without being creepy, scientific genius and with a complex emotional turmoil regarding "the other guy" rather than a simplified fear of losing control.

[Raz9000x]

The Avengers are my favorite superhero team, Cap my favorite hero, and I've been very impressed with all the Marvel Studios movies so far. So I'm not exactly unbiased when I say I absolutely freakin' loved this movie. The pacing was fantastic, and though I normally don't like action flicks to go over two hours, I didn't mind it here at all because the movie just flew by in the best way possible. Each character was given his or her time to shine and did so in spectacular fashion, especially Dr. Banner and "the other guy." It had a great combination of humor, drama and Pure Awesome. So many great moments.

Like Thorpacolypse said, I could list the criticisms I had with it, but I don't care to. It was a genre film, the best of its kind, so I'm giving it a pass in some areas. It was a statement by Whedon and Marvel: If you want to make a superhero movie, do it like this.

Oh, and THANOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bladewind]

The comment about DC now not being able to outdo Marvel is bang on.

Marvel took the time to ramp this up. No matter what you felt about the previous movies, the characters were already introduced. We could hit the ground running. Even Hawkeye with his minor role in Thor was properly set up for things here.

Superman movies, in the context of all other movies fail to deliver on the epicness of the character. Yes Luthor is bad-ass, but he's just a guy. I want Superman cutting loose and fighting something on his level and not have it to be Doomsday. And a few decently placed comments (such as in the Val Kilmer Batman... "Where will you go? The circus is probably half way to Metropolis..." don't create a back drop much less a universe.

Like it, dislike it, the Avengers was well set-up and executed.

There is no way a movie can summarize or lay the groundwork for 50+ years of comics - regardless of character(s) involved.

[Unbeliever]

Like it, dislike it, the Avengers was well set-up and executed.
...
Superman movies, in the context of all other movies fail to deliver on the epicness of the character. Yes Luthor is bad-ass, but he's just a guy. I want Superman cutting loose and fighting something on his level and not have it to be Doomsday.

I agree with half of this. It was well, and ambitiously, set up. It was a daring move to lay the groundwork for all the characters in their individual movies, and did allow the Avengers film to hit the ground running, relatively speaking. All that had to be done was get them to team up, which was nice b/c it got to focus on their own personal foibles. That has always been Marvel's strong point, and to my thinking part of their distinct branding: their heroes have feet of clay, disagreements, come to blows (all the time it seems ...).

But, I think it had a big problem in execution. I quoted Bladewind's comments re: Superman, not only b/c I agree with them, but also b/c I feel Avengers had a lot of the same problems. The climax was big and loud and dizzying. But, there was little dramatic tension. None of the villains could match any 1 of the heavy-hitters in combat. On the one hand, that's fine. Close-quarters combat was really never Loki's thing, while his brother is the lord of all beatdowns (tm). But, it made the climax empty -- more of a question of "how are they going to beat these bad guys with trivial ease," which is more or less the same feeling I get when I watch Superman films.

[Bladewind]

I have to admit that I agree with Unbeliever. Except that I didn't mind that it was only a question of how they were going to win. After all, it's a story where the good guys always win and whether conscious or not, you walk in knowing that Loki will lose.

[Rabbitman]

...
But, it made the climax empty -- more of a question of "how are they going to beat these bad guys with trivial ease," which is more or less the same feeling I get when I watch Superman films.

I would disagree on that point, the dramatic tension didn't come from any one on one threat, but the concept that the enemy was seemingly infinite in number and the device causing the problem couldn't be shut-down or otherwise overcome by any of the heroes by conventional means.

The rising pressure from the politicians to resort to more drastic measures set an even more immediate deadline to the situation than a simple matter of how long the Avengers could physically keep it up, and the only possible lack of tension comes from knowing as an audience that surely the good guys have to win in the end.

Other than making an out of continuity once off or closed trilogy Christopher Nolan style, any Supers movie is going to have the "We know they win" clause, so I really don't see that as a fault.

[Unbeliever]

I don't want to be misunderstood. In a great many of movies you "know" that the heroes are going to win. This is doubly true in a comic book movie since they are franchise oriented. I was also reasonably confident that [spoilers] the Rebels were going to manage to blow up the Death Star.

But, dramatic tension is still a thing. And, part of pulling it off in an action/adventure film (or story more generally) is creating a sense of danger. The heroes may suffer, either themselves or by proxy, and part of the trick of good storytelling is putting you on the edge of your seat even though deep down you pretty much know what is going to happen. For example, many of us who saw "the Fellowship of the Ring" had read the books. So, we knew what was going to happen in excruciating detail. To the extent that the film still managed to have an emotional impact of some sort or another, it succeeded at dramatic tension.

I just don't think the Avengers managed that trick. The climactic fight lacked weight or depth ... for lack of a better term. I don't claim that any of that stuff is easy, but it is what a director of such a film is supposed to pull off.