The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

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Libra
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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Libra » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:53 pm

Oh … YEAH. :shock:
Hmm, who to do next.
Now here's challenge, should you choose to take it; why not try working the various DC and Marvel Animated series together! :wink:
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Post by Voltron64 » Tue Mar 04, 2014 3:47 pm

Here's a thought, what if Two-Face was in a similar position like Dr. Doom, his original scars being comparatively superficial (actually in the 1st degree; being fairly bad but not utterly horrific) with his current look being the result of self-mutilation?
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Re:

Post by Charles Phipps » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:26 pm

Voltron64 wrote:Here's a thought, what if Two-Face was in a similar position like Dr. Doom, his original scars being comparatively superficial (actually in the 1st degree; being fairly bad but not utterly horrific) with his current look being the result of self-mutilation?
I'm of the school that Harvey Dent was going to go crazy anyway because there's something in Gotham City's water. His deformity just gave him the context to shape his two-obsession.

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Re: Re:

Post by EnigmaticOne » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:53 pm

Charles Phipps wrote:
Voltron64 wrote:Here's a thought, what if Two-Face was in a similar position like Dr. Doom, his original scars being comparatively superficial (actually in the 1st degree; being fairly bad but not utterly horrific) with his current look being the result of self-mutilation?
I'm of the school that Harvey Dent was going to go crazy anyway because there's something in Gotham City's water. His deformity just gave him the context to shape his two-obsession.
Funny you should mention that. There's been a theory I heard from someone that Arkhamverse Gotham is so bad because the Lazarus pit open under Gotham has been leaking at very low but constant levels for a century or more, and the exposure has promoted general craziness over time the way it does Ra's after half a dozen dips.
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Re: Re:

Post by Charles Phipps » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:57 pm

EnigmaticOne wrote:Funny you should mention that. There's been a theory I heard from someone that Arkhamverse Gotham is so bad because the Lazarus pit open under Gotham has been leaking at very low but constant levels for a century or more, and the exposure has promoted general craziness over time the way it does Ra's after half a dozen dips.
It makes a lot of sense. You could also steal a bit from Batman Begins and Scarecrow's Fear gas is based around Gotham City's natural gases.

Possibly Joker's too.

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Re: Re:

Post by Voltron64 » Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:56 am

EnigmaticOne wrote:
Charles Phipps wrote:
Voltron64 wrote:Here's a thought, what if Two-Face was in a similar position like Dr. Doom, his original scars being comparatively superficial (actually in the 1st degree; being fairly bad but not utterly horrific) with his current look being the result of self-mutilation?
I'm of the school that Harvey Dent was going to go crazy anyway because there's something in Gotham City's water. His deformity just gave him the context to shape his two-obsession.
Funny you should mention that. There's been a theory I heard from someone that Arkhamverse Gotham is so bad because the Lazarus pit open under Gotham has been leaking at very low but constant levels for a century or more, and the exposure has promoted general craziness over time the way it does Ra's after half a dozen dips.
And of course it makes Ra's a bigger hypocrite for wanting to destroy Gotham.
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Certainly it would be a better world if bigotry were rewarded with a straightjacket and a padded cell more often. - Libra

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:07 pm

Libra wrote: Now here's challenge, should you choose to take it; why not try working the various DC and Marvel Animated series together! :wink:
I'm open for ideas on that, though Bruce Wayne living a ripe-old 145 and setting Batman Begins in 2099 is too good of a opportunity to miss.

Also, for anyone who cares, I've got reviews of the Amazing Spiderman (movie) and Arkham Origins (game) up on my website.

Origins: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogsp ... eview.html

Spiderman: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogsp ... eview.html

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Re: Re:

Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:16 pm

Voltron64 wrote:
And of course it makes Ra's a bigger hypocrite for wanting to destroy Gotham.
I think AA adds an interesting dimension to Ra's. That, about 1855, he was still interested in saving the world and built Gotham City as the City of Tomorrow (before Metropolis) and that it was a way to show the world how to live in his Paradise.

And they turned it into a crime-ridden cesspool.

Given the hints that implies about his future Eden, no WONDER he wants to eradicate Wonder City/Gotham.

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by EnigmaticOne » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:46 pm

Quincy Sharp

Quincy Sharp is a man who has gone down in flames. Having resigned his mayoralty and facing a slew of criminal charges for his role in Hugo Strange's misdeeds, he's become a mocked, pathetic, broken figure.

The real tragedy, is that had events gone differently, he might have been up there in the Gotham pantheon with Batman, Bruce Wayne and James Gordon.

A wealthy Gotham VIP with a Master's in Public Policy, Sharp was far more intelligent than people tended to give him credit for. In the aftermath of Arkham Origins, he saw an issue that almost no one else in Gotham saw coming, even Batman: namely, the rise of malefactors with the wrong combination of insanity (medically if not legally) with criminal savvy was just beginning.

It wasn't just a failure of mismanagement at Blackgate, it was never meant for the likes of the Joker. Sharp got it re-opened, and honestly intended to see Arkham through to success.

Unfortunately, Gotham's Worst were even worse than expected, and at the same time it all began, Strange and the secret emissaries of Ra's stepped in. Sharp's pomposity and ambition were his weak spots.
And do we tend to question the perfect offer?
To make it worse, Strange employed brainwashing and manipulation to carefully influence Warden/Mayor Sharp. Between Arkham Asylum and Arkham City, Sharp realized what a monster Strange was, but the keys to the system had been hijacked by the Professor. Sharp was helpless and it was only a formality for Strange to toss him into Arkham City.
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Re: Re:

Post by Voltron64 » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:49 pm

Charles Phipps wrote:
Voltron64 wrote:
And of course it makes Ra's a bigger hypocrite for wanting to destroy Gotham.
I think AA adds an interesting dimension to Ra's. That, about 1855, he was still interested in saving the world and built Gotham City as the City of Tomorrow (before Metropolis) and that it was a way to show the world how to live in his Paradise.

And they turned it into a crime-ridden cesspool.
Did they? Or did Ra's?
Power doesn't corrupt. Power appeals to the corrupt. - Charles Phipps

Certainly it would be a better world if bigotry were rewarded with a straightjacket and a padded cell more often. - Libra

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Mar 05, 2014 4:52 pm

The Penguin

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There is a tendency to believe that the rich of Gotham are assailed by the poor with Batman being their protector rather than the reverse, at least in certain circles. Oswald Cobblepot is a tremendous example of why the Old Money families of Gotham City are just as corrupt as the destitute.

A century ago, the Cobblepot family was every bit as rich as the Wayne family. While their name hints at their humble origins, by the year 1855, patriarch Henry Cobblepot made sure they were amongst the richest families in America.
Henry Cobblepot was an individual that Cyrus Pinkney and Solomon Wayne barely tolerated. Not
because he was a low-class lout, Cyrus Pinkney was, but because even amongst aristocrats--he was an obnoxious snob.
While it is somewhat counterproductive to suggest the Waynes were always upstanding citizens and
the Cobblepots were corrupt exploiters, one needs only look into the question of Satanic Bat-worship during Pilgrimes times, the latter were infamous in their brutality to the working class.

The Cobblepots sold rotting meat to the Army during the Civil War, put down strikes with Pinkerton Detectives, and built their fortune from stolen Native Lands when other Old Money families were content to do just one. No bloodline was more adept at manufactured class and culture than the most corrupt in America.
The Cobblepots misfortunes began as early as the 1930s with Prohibition. Oswald's Great-Grandfather began the family association with organized crime when the family fortunes were still secure and made all manner of underworld connections. The Justice Society and a past incarnation of Bruce Wayne, created by the Omega Sanction, fought this predecessor to the Penguin for decades.

Sadly, the corruption he helped implement won.
Class is a tricky thing, though, and the Cobblepots fortunes began to wain (*rimshot*) by the 1980s. Thomas Wayne testified before the New York (a.ka. Gotham State) Supreme Court as to the massive wrongdoings of Cobblepot Enterprises.

These included Theodore Cobblepot attempting to murder a patient of his with a poisoned umbrella, attempting to bribe him, misuse of charity funds donated to him, and a host of other crimes. Martha Wayne also testified his wife arranged for a robbery of her fellow society maidens. A life of gross mismanagement and arrogance had led the married cousins to ruin their fortune and seek other ways to rebuild it.

Both died in prison.

Oswald, already cursed with a number of unfortunate conditions due to the Cobblepot tendency to marry their cousins, found himself suddenly destitute. Kicked out of British boarding school, he returned to Gotham City unable to pay his parents' massive bills. He lost his mansion, cars, the respect of Gotham City's corrupt families, and even his ability to bribe people into pretending to be his friends.
Which, notably, may account for his parents sudden demise.
What the Oswald didn't lose was his mind or a lifetime of being prepped for skullduggery. The Falcone Family had no particular love of the Cobblepots and were glad to see them fall but Oswald managed to sweet talk them into letting him handle certain "responsibilities." By the time Falcone fell during the Long Halloween, the newly-styled Penguin had tripled profits (and sent the vast majority of it into his private accounts).
Oswald hated the moniker of the Penguin for the first two decades of his criminal career but has gradually resigned himself to the fact people are less making fun of him now than it's simply his brand. He'll never have Gotham City's respect but he has managed to gain its fear.

As a result, his people can call him the Penguin and customers (and they get overcharged). Everyone else? Not so much.
Much like Harvey Dent, the Penguin is an individual capable of bridging the gap between "Freak" and "Mobster." He's perfectly rationale but possesses no ability to empathize with others, massive narcissism, and a sadistic streak a mile wide. People find his bird obsession cute right up until he feeds you ones he's had bred who eat human flesh while the subject is still alive. The Penguin is motivated, primarily, by a depressed self-image and secretly believes everyone hates him. They're right but this is, in large part, due to his self-sabotage and preemptive retribution against people he THINKS would slight him. A little flattery or pretensions to respect go a long way with Penguin.

Despite numerous setbacks, the Penguin is now one of the richest men in Gotham. What land Bruce Wayne doesn't own downtown belongs to the Penguin through shell companies and he has a longstanding "Triangle Trade" arranged through Wilson Fisk, The Owl, and Don Domino in New York City. Even Metropolis' Intergang does business with the Penguin on the latter's terms, the scions of Darkseid unable to out-freak one who has the friendship of the Joker.
Which terrifies Cobblepot
The Penguin can usually be found accompanied by a number of goons and at least two attractive women, who may or may not be mercenaries in his employ. The Penguin has a Jabba the Hutt-level of fondness for women but there's something of a question how much his attentions are genuine. The Penguin's issues, sexual and otherwise, are a vertible Freudian quagmire of neuroses. He's certainly willing to act the part of the misandrist skirt chaser, though.

Despite being a ruthless gang boss, the Penguin has managed to establish not only the Iceberg Lounge but a vertible cornicopia of Penguin-brand products based on his criminal identity. These include Iceberg Casinos in Vegas and on the Gotham waterfront, Iceberg Ice Cream (which sells heroin), Iceberg Films (porn), Iceberg Ice (which transports guns), and Iceberg Fish and Canning (which does human trafficking). The fact he's become a local celebrity that people ignore the notorious acts of due to his "roguish but comical" exterior is something which galls Batman.
Recently, the Penguin has adopted a Cockney accent. No one is sure where the hell that came from but he thinks its cool.
Last edited by Charles Phipps on Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:31 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Voltron64 » Wed Mar 05, 2014 5:04 pm

Penguin's inbred, huh?

Explains a few things... :roll:
Power doesn't corrupt. Power appeals to the corrupt. - Charles Phipps

Certainly it would be a better world if bigotry were rewarded with a straightjacket and a padded cell more often. - Libra

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Mar 05, 2014 5:05 pm

Voltron64 wrote:Penguin's inbred, huh?

Explains a few things... :roll:
My own addition but, really, doesn't it make sense?

I'm imagining Penguin moving to New York at one point to try and fill the gap during one of the Kingpin's many falls from grace only to end up just as obsessed with Spiderman as every other villain there. Really, Spiderman had NO end of material to work with and was used to animal-themed villains.*

After he returned to Gotham a broken man, Batman sent Spiderman a fruit-basket saying he should send his villains to New York more often.

Spiderman STILL doesn't believe it could have come from Batman.

:)

* Oswald did make a good friend in the Vulture, though.

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by Voltron64 » Wed Mar 05, 2014 5:09 pm

Plus, a good way to roleplay Cobblepot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juYsmbxK8Vc

:mrgreen:
Power doesn't corrupt. Power appeals to the corrupt. - Charles Phipps

Certainly it would be a better world if bigotry were rewarded with a straightjacket and a padded cell more often. - Libra

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Re: The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

Post by greycrusader » Wed Mar 05, 2014 6:33 pm

Charles:

Re the Penguin: I can certainly see the Felonious Fowl as an elitist snob and a shameless chauvinist who relentlessly objectifies women, but I never really saw any comic-book based examples of the Penguin being racist or (literally) sexist. Are you just inferring those qualities from his upbringing? My take on Oswald Cobblepot is a ruthless, mean, and selfish man who is also pathetically insecure and lonely. I tend to see him as man with a lot of disguised self-loathing, a result of a terrible body image, inability to have a loving relationship outside of his deceased mother, and an unwelcome awareness of his own shortcomings.

And unlike many of Gotham's other nasties, I think the Penguin finds the Joker as terrifying as do most civilians (Edward Nigma does as well, and for better cause, as Mr. J considers the Riddler's M.O. a pale knock-off of his own).

I found the episode of BATMAN:TAS where Oswald tried to reform and win the affections of a socialite one of the more poignant of the show.

All my best.
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