The Combined DCU-Marvel Universe thread

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Post by dirkgentry2000 » Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:37 am

Charles Phipps wrote:Iron Man
As much as I was annoyed by the Civil War - I mainly enjoyed the Skrull Invasion (although it could have been a lot shorter IMHO)

I find myself looking forward to the upcoming Dark Reign storyline where Iron Man is on the run from the government (and it's Norman Osborne led meta-human security forces)

also - what's up with Norman Osborne morphing into DC Comics 1990s version of Lex Luthor at some point?

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Post by Charles Phipps » Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:44 am

Ask and you shall recieve.

Captain Marvel

Billy Batson sometimes feels like he's the only person who gets being a superhero. He's been one since he's been eight years old and now that he's sixteen, moving on seventeen, he's pretty certain he's more experienced than the vast majority of these self-styled superheroes that show up and announce themselves to acclaim before proceeding to crash and burn in their own angst.

Really, Billy has outlasted most of them. Once, a long time ago, it seemed that it was only him and Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain America and a few others were the only real superheroes around the block. In fact, he was even briefly more popular than Superman. Now, he's a bit more of an obscure figure but if you ask who the World's Mightiest Mortal is. You don't answer the Hulk, you say the name of the Wizard who granted Billy his powers.

The wisdom of Solomon; the strength of Hercules; the stamina of Atlas; the power of Zeus; the courage of Achilles; and the speed of Mercury. Few really get just how powerful that makes him. It was to Hercules' annoyance when the Avenger decided to test the man who supposedly had "his" strength and promptly got his posterior handed to him. As the Mighty Thor says "Young Batson is one of the few mortals that the Gods have chosen very wisely to bestow their powers upon and I am proud to fight by his side."

Captain Marvel has frequently been treated as being somewhat of a wet blanket. Quite a few people have asked if he's from an exceptionally religious family since he, his sister, and Freddy seem to be a bit naive compared to the other heroes out there. Billy, on the contrary, is anything but. You can't have faced Nazis, thanks to some wonderful time travel escapades of Doctor Sivana's machines gone wrong, and be naive. Billy just has something that he thinks other heroes should remember; the integrity to know that he has an example to set.

You know that you're a Galahad figure when even Superman occasionally feels guilty in your presence.

Currently, Billy is holding the power of Shazam in custody until his old mentor's ghost safely returns from the afterlife. Billy isn't a wizard and has no intentions of becoming the Sorcerer Supreme, which Shazam once was before turning that position over to the Ancient One. However, his area of concern is protecting the universe from creatures like Sabbac and other terrible forces that few superheroes ever really face. Superman, for all his might, is fairly helpless against something like Neron but each blow of Shazam's Champion burns with equal parts righteous fury and the might of the divine.

In truth, Billy is just happy to be a superhero and has managed to keep Fawcett City pretty clean of figures like Lex Luthor or the Joker. Even Doctor Sivanna has more or less given up trying to take over his old home and has moved on to greener pastures outside of the man's city. It's an accomplishment few heroes can manage; to have actually made their home city safe. It lead the slightly more ambitious Freddy Freeman to move to Las Vegas instead in search of greener pastures.

There's two things that do seriously annoy Billy.

The first is the fact that his nonconfrontational attitude keeps getting mistaken by people for him being a pushover. A man who can go 1-1 in fights with Superman and Thor, who can calm down the Hulk, and has defeated the Ruler of Hell with the purity of his soul is not someone you want to get on the bad side of. Yet people like Guy Gardner keep trying to get into his face, Mar-vell and his various descendants take his codename (something he was very happy to let them use but they might have ASKED), and people constantly try and put down his strength or attitude. It's enough to try even his infinite patience.

The second is the fact that there's too many people who try and go after his sister. Mary Marvel is slightly less noble than Billy. Given that's roughly equivalent to saying slightly less noble than King Arthur, that's not saying much. Still, it's the one area Billy stops being the nice guy. Mary Marvel's brief brainwashing by Darkseid is something he doesn't like to speak of. However, it lasted only long enough for Billy Batson to go to his "old Pal" Orion and request a Boom Tube. Darkseid has been defeated before....never was it so thoroughly one sided. Nor was Billy's promise that if Darkseid ever hurt his family again, Billy would take him to the Source and then trap him in the Light forever. A fate even worse than death for a being of pure evil.

It's always the Nice Ones...

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Post by Khantalas » Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:54 am

Now do the rest of the Marvel family. And the Black Adam family. And Doctor Sivana.
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Post by Charles Phipps » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:00 am

Dirk Gentry wrote:Can't believe I missed this thread. Good stuff, Libra and Charles - -as I've come to expect.

Curious to see what you do with the new Skrull Invasion (one suspects the Martian Manhunter - if alive on Earth-777 - would have infilitrated the enemy ranks and sown chaos.)
Well to be honest, I don't really consider it all that major of an event in the Marvel universe. This is about their natures as people rather than too much in the way of recent events. I just wanted to acknowledge their existence.

Civil War is a minor portion of Tony Stark's life. As a man whose father has all the Iron Man comics up to adulthood and as a man who has the rest, I just used it to highlight Tony Stark has always been the Government Dude and the Optimist.

You'll note I didn't mention Negative Zone Guantonamo in my write-up.
Dirk Gentry wrote:Hoping you fellows choose to ignore the recent mess of Batman RIP and Final Crisis. If you do decide to address those events - - well, maybe your take on it will help me understand WTF has actually happened there. Smile
I don't know what happened in Final Crisis, but I'll give you a Batman R.I.P. bit.
Dirk Gentry wrote:Also - just a personal note - I'd love to see something on the interactions between the Nova Centurions and the Green Lantern Corps. I suspect Richard Rider and Kyle Rayner have a LOT to talk about - - and I'm curious about the Nova Worldmind's take on the sudden proliferation of various-hued ring-slingers in the cosmos (Red Lanterns, Yellow Lanterns, Pink-ringed Star Sapphires, Blue Lanterns - and the as-of-yet unseen Orange and Black Lanterns)
I'll see what I can do.
Last edited by Charles Phipps on Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Charles Phipps » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:00 am

Batman R.I.P

The Dark Knight has recently faked his own death and retreated into the Batcave in order to do some much needed soul searching and reaffirmation of the reason that he fights crime. With the Joker inactive, in large part because Batman isn't present, and the majority of Gotham's supervillains locked away; it's the best time as any to engage in some new training and meditation. The regular criminal activities of the city can be handled by Dick Grayson and Tim Drake plus the rest of the "Bat Family" without much difficulty. Even Batman, after all, has a breaking point and needs some R&R or he'll lose perspective.

The impetuous for Batman taking a vacation of all things is due to a recent plot by a man named Doctor Simon Hurt and a collection of minor super criminals calling themselves the Black Glove Society. Their goal was to psychologically destroy him. It's not as if Batman hasn't faced similiar plots by foes with much more intimate psychological connections to himself (Harvey Dent, Jason Todd, and even Hush have all done much more damage to him and been much more personal). In fact, it was Bane who came closest to succeeding. Really, by Batman's standards, the Black Glove Society was child's play. Attempting to send a beautiful debutante to seduce Bruce Wayne was an obvious ploy and playing on his childhood trauma of his parent's death was....just tacky.

No, what caused Batman to take a step back from his lifestyle was something far deeper and more chilling. It was looking into the eyes of Doctor Simon Hurt and saw the face of pure evil. Batman had confronted the Devil, Neron, and other manifestations of evil before. They didn't phase him. Instead, what he saw in Doctor Simon Hurt was even more disturbing as it was a face of a man who was as evil as anything that Batman had encountered. A man who despised the Batman and wanted him dead without conscience, pity, or remorse. This was not new. He'd seen that look in the Joker's eyes and other sociopaths. Yet, he was a man who despised Batman because Batman represented JUSTICE. Evil, in its purest and most concentrated form in the human soul, was afraid of Batman because he represented something more than terror.

In that, Batman had suceeded in his goal of understanding the mind of the Joker and other villains, that he'd ironically come to Doctor Hurt to comprehend.

For the longest time, Batman has viewed his altar ego as a creature of darkness that fought fire with fire. The idea that his crusade had somehow created an icon that was still viewed as something noble in the hearts of his enemies was something he'd never expected. After all, it wasn't as if he was an Adam West character beloved by the law. For once, Batman needed to think about what he wanted the Batman to represent.

Is it purely something meant to terrify criminals or perhaps, just maybe, is there room for something inside him to inspire hope?

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Post by Ecalsneerg » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:22 am

Charles Phipps wrote:Mar-vell and his various descendants take his codename (something he was very happy to let them use but they might have ASKED)
I was genuinely laughing at this one.

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Post by dirkgentry2000 » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:25 am

Charles Phipps wrote:Batman R.I.P

The Dark Knight has recently faked his own death and retreated into the Batcave in order to do some much needed soul searching and reaffirmation of the reason that he fights crime. With the Joker inactive, in large part because Batman isn't present, and the majority of Gotham's supervillains locked away; it's the best time as any to engage in some new training and meditation. The regular criminal activities of the city can be handled by Dick Grayson and Tim Drake plus the rest of the "Bat Family" without much difficulty. Even Batman, after all, has a breaking point and needs some R&R or he'll lose perspective.

The impetuous for Batman taking a vacation of all things is due to a recent plot by a man named Doctor Simon Hurt and a collection of minor super criminals calling themselves the Black Glove Society. Their goal was to psychologically destroy him. It's not as if Batman hasn't faced similiar plots by foes with much more intimate psychological connections to himself (Harvey Dent, Jason Todd, and even Hush have all done much more damage to him and been much more personal). In fact, it was Bane who came closest to succeeding. Really, by Batman's standards, the Black Glove Society was child's play. Attempting to send a beautiful debutante to seduce Bruce Wayne was an obvious ploy and playing on his childhood trauma of his parent's death was....just tacky.

No, what caused Batman to take a step back from his lifestyle was something far deeper and more chilling. It was looking into the eyes of Doctor Simon Hurt and saw the face of pure evil. Batman had confronted the Devil, Neron, and other manifestations of evil before. They didn't phase him. Instead, what he saw in Doctor Simon Hurt was even more disturbing as it was a face of a man who was as evil as anything that Batman had encountered. A man who despised the Batman and wanted him dead without conscience, pity, or remorse. This was not new. He'd seen that look in the Joker's eyes and other sociopaths. Yet, he was a man who despised Batman because Batman represented JUSTICE. Evil, in its purest and most concentrated form in the human soul, was afraid of Batman because he represented something more than terror.

In that, Batman had suceeded in his goal of understanding the mind of the Joker and other villains, that he'd ironically come to Doctor Hurt to comprehend.

For the longest time, Batman has viewed his altar ego as a creature of darkness that fought fire with fire. The idea that his crusade had somehow created an icon that was still viewed as something noble in the hearts of his enemies was something he'd never expected. After all, it wasn't as if he was an Adam West character beloved by the law. For once, Batman needed to think about what he wanted the Batman to represent.

Is it purely something meant to terrify criminals or perhaps, just maybe, is there room for something inside him to inspire hope?
Nicely done and may I say I enjoyed your short post a lot more than I enjoyed the last couple issues of RIP...

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Post by Libra » Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:57 am

Keep up the most excellent work Charles! :D
also - what's up with Norman Osborne morphing into DC Comics 1990s version of Lex Luthor at some point?
I think it's less a matter of that than The Green Goblin doing damage any which way he can. My idea of the Green Goblin is that he's functionally an amalgam of the Joker and Lex Luthor.
Can't believe I missed this thread. Good stuff, Libra and Charles - -as I've come to expect.
Spare my blushes, I've barely done anything. It's Charles who deserves the compliments. :oops:
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Post by Psistrike » Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:39 pm

Captain Marvel, the one superhero you don't want to face on your own, no matter who you are.

And I haven't read any comics in years and only heard about Batman R.I.P. online. I'm guessing your version is at least 100xs better than what DC did. :D

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Post by Libra » Wed Dec 31, 2008 8:00 am

Charles is - so far as I am concerned - a Genius.

The 100% is probably an understatement. :wink:
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Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Dec 31, 2008 8:07 am

Libra wrote:Charles is - so far as I am concerned - a Genius.

The 100% is probably an understatement. :wink:
You overflatter me, Libra.

In any case, I'm going to try and handle Black Adam next and then maybe Captain America. Both versions.

Remember, everyone is free to post their own variants.

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Post by Libra » Wed Dec 31, 2008 8:22 am

My dear Charles, I'm being absolutely sincere and I'm therefore complimenting you. :D

I hope to have some more work up after New Year, but I've been working on a Pet Project of my own in the meantime. . .
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Post by Charles Phipps » Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:42 pm

Norman Osbourne

Peter Parker used to believe that Norman Osbourne was Harry Osbourne's distant but loving father. That he was a victim of a scientific experiment gone horribly wrong that resulted in a deviant criminal personality emerging. Peter believed, with time and help, Norman could recover. Peter has since modified his view. Peter Parker now believes whatever happened in that 'Goblin formula' chamber just unlocked the true monstrous face of what was there all along.

Norman Osbourne is, in many ways, a poor man's Lex Luthor. He's never been as talented, brilliant, or cold bloodedly skilled as his chief business rival (Tony Stark tends not to dabble in the weapons markets anymore). In fact, Norman's initial bankruptcy problems were caused primarily by the fact that Alexander Luthor was just plain smarter than Norman. Since the faithful day that Norman Osbourne took the Goblin formula, he's had significantly better luck as a rival to LexCorp's CEO. Norman's already fragile sanity would take a nosedive if he knew that Lex Luthor probably already owns his company through various holdings. It's just Lex actually admires the pure villainy that Norman displays and is the main reason that no one has fired him from his chairman's position.

Norman was always a raging egomaniac that barely kept his temper in check. The Goblin Formula added paranoid schizophrenia to Norman Osbourne's many endearing qualities, including audiotory and visual hallucinations but that doesn't explain why he hates Spiderman as much as he does. You could argue that he hates Peter Parker for any number of reasons. Peter Parker's responsibility for his son's many near-death experienecs for example. In fact, the real reason is almost pathetic. Norman has lost to Peter Parker on dozens of occasions and he can't stand the fact that Peter is still standing after all of his retalliations. His ego is that fragile.

Norman's sheer petty vileness manifests itself in a variety of ways. One famous incident was underwriting lonely college Professor Miles Warren's cloning research and then using it to create children of his enemy's girlfriend so he could frame her for an affair right before he murdered her (Norman would have been able to dangle his faked and disgusting sexual conquests in front of Peter parker's face more if not for the fact he spent several years in rehab because of the aftereffects). Norman isn't sexist; he's an outright misogynist who gets off by abusing women be they Doctor Karla Sofen, Songbird, or Mary Jane Parker.

Honestly, Norman Osbourne's return to power by associating with various criminal cartels and secret government conspiracies is like a nightmare for Spiderman. Peter Parker's willingness to deal with problems on his own has kept most of the superhero community from realizing what an utter monster that the famous Munitions Mogul really is. Only recently has Tony Stark, for example, realized what Spiderman had to deal with in a man who habitually abuses and discards people in a nightmarishly causal fashion.

One could be forgiven if one believed a legendary story that the Rose, attempting to rid the world of the Green Goblin, sent a line of clues to the Joker to indicate that Norman Osbourne was stealing his stickhe. According to the story, the Joker intended to kill Norman Osbourne for being a serious crook who ruined a good joke. After ten minutes, the two were laughing like old friends and Norman wrote Joker a million dollar check for various weapons of horrible destruction after sharing stories of torment.

It's probably untrue but Norman's mind is gone enough that one might seriously believe the Joker and him could get along.

Recently; Norman Osbourne has managed to parlay through blackmail, bribes and intimidation himself into the position of SHIELD's Director. Most of this is the result of Luthor holdovers latching themselves onto him but undoubtedly Lex himself is also involved. Norman Osbourne intends to use this to eventually place himself in the White House as well and rule over a world that will not have any Spidermen or other costumed fools to stop him. It is the beginning of his Dark Reign.
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Post by Davies » Wed Dec 31, 2008 4:18 pm

Yeesh. Scary.

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Post by Psistrike » Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:32 pm

Now that definatelly sounds like the kind of Green Goblin you just love to hate. Great work, Charles.

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