Pocket Ultimate Power Available

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby FuzzyBoots » Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:07 am

Incidentally, I took advantage of the $30 for both pocket manuals deal and they came in the mail yesterday. Everything seems to be in order.

Elric, I will try to remember to check on those errata tonight. My impression, though, was that they just did some minor formatting changes to get the book to fit into pocket format.

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby FuzzyBoots » Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:07 am

Elric wrote:Pg 46, Emotion Control—the “Fail by 10” line that the current errata says should be deleted should be moved to the Calm emotion’s description, as mentioned here:

Line was deleted and was not added to Calm.
Elric wrote:Pg 61, Affects Corporeal states “This extra is required for any effect that works on corporeal targets while you are insubstantial at rank 2 or greater (see the Affects Corporeal description for details).”

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 68, Move Object: At the end of the fourth paragraph of this power’s description, add the sentence (or something like this) “Move Object counts as if it forced a saving throw for power level purposes.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 70, Paralyze: The errata for core-book Paralyze changes its wording so that it says that being helpless only prevents physical actions.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 73, Regeneration: 1) The Resurrection extra on Regeneration gives a misleading description when it says “At nine ranks you can check to recover from death each round.” Looking at the table below it’s clear that at eight ranks you can check to recover from death each round, so this should say eight ranks. Nine ranks lets you do this as a standard action, which is really no different in the vast majority of cases because you come back Unconscious and Disabled and won’t get to take actions anyway. So this should probably be errata’d to say "eight ranks" instead because writing "at nine ranks" implies that eight ranks won't do the trick.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:2) In the paragraph where total Regeneration has been errata’d to cost 36 pp, not 35 pp, counting ability damage at once a round with no rest this should be 44 pp, not 43 pp.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 75, Shrinking: Under the Compression extra, it says: “your weight and carrying capacity modifier remain the same regardless of size, but you gain Strength and Constitution from your increased density.” However, the Density power does not increase Constitution; it increases Toughness. So this should say Toughness where it currently says Constitution.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 93, Trip. 1) At the end of this power’s description, add the following sentence (or something like it) “Trip counts as if it forced a saving throw for power level purposes.”

Fixed.
Elric wrote:2) Under the Opposed by Ability extra is the following sentence: “The effect can sometimes take advantage of targets with an inferior ability, but at the cost of being less effective against targets with a superior ability score.”

This sentence is false; since those targets could choose to use that ability score to resist the trip regardless, the extra is strictly superior to the base Trip power. I’d just delete this sentence—Opposed by Ability Trip is strictly superior to regular trip, but since Improved Throw is a 1 pp power feat and that’s strictly superior to Opposed by Ability Trip, there’s no room for an in-between cost here.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:3) Also, the power feat “Improved Trip” should be referred to everywhere as “Improved Throw” (which is the feat it is actually based on).

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 104, Feedback: This flaw should presumably be changed in the same way that the Feedback flaw on Telekinesis (pg 195) is currently changed in the errata.

Fixed? Not entirely certain what the change was, but the entries for both Feedback for Telekinesis and for Feedback indicate that you add the rank of the effect to your will save bonus for the toughness save.
Elric wrote:Pg 108-109, Array:
1) On page 109, it says “So if you have an Array with Blast, Dazzle, Force Field, and Flight Alternate Powers, for example, you can only use one of these each round, the others don’t work and aren’t consid- ered in effect.”

This isn’t correct; the restriction is that you can only use one of these at a time (and can only switch once a round as a free action). For example, if your array starts on Blast then using Blast, switching the Flight as a free action and using Flight in a round is legal. So this should read “one of these at a time” rather than what it says above.

Fixed. By the by, in almost every case where you've suggested a changed sentence, they have your exact sentence in there. :)
Elric wrote:Pg 113, Variable: In the second paragraph, delete the sentence “No trait can have a rank or bonus greater than your Variable structure rank.”

Fixed.
Elric wrote:The following passage on the right hand side of pg 113 should be removed in light of the removal of the “rank limitation”

“So, for example, a charac- ter with Variable 1 (any one skill, 4 points/rank) can acquire 1 rank in any one skill at a time (since the trait is limited to the power’s rank). This costs only a fourth of a power point, but the remaining points can’t be allocated to anything, since the effect is limited to one skill at a time. The same is true with feats and some low-cost powers. Variable structures simply pay a premium for them.”

Fixed. Replaced, I think, with an explanation involving feats, indicating that the 4pt Variable (single feat) means you can buy one feat, or multiple ranks of a feat, but may still "lose" points due to the premium.
Elric wrote:Pg 124, Absorption: The Absorption power grants a 2 pp/rank Boost, which is different from the Absorption extra on Protection on page 71 (and Absorption in the core book), which only provides a 1 pp/rank Boost. This should presumably be changed, as Steve seems to acknowledge here: viewtopic.php?t=24394

Fixed.
Elric wrote:The wording on the Absorption power suggests that you get “one rank of Healing per 2 power points, as usual).” This could be changed to “one rank of Healing (Flaw: Personal) per power point” while changing the Absorption effect to grant 1 power point for every 1 damage bonus absorbed.

Fixed. Didn't use your exact words this time.
Elric wrote:Pg 141, Cold Control: The Weaken Alternate Power states “Weaken: Super-cooling materials can render them brittle and easily broken. This is a Ranged Affects Objects Drain Toughness effect at your Cold Control rank.”

This should probably say ‘Ranged Affects Only Objects Drain Toughness effect.’

Close, but they add the "at your Cold Control rank" codecil.
Elric wrote:Pg 144, Darkness Control: The Life Drain Alternate Power says “Your darkness can actually diminish the “light” within living creatures, draining away their very life force as a Drain Constitution effect at your power rank (two-thirds your rank if it’s Ranged).”

However, if this is just Drain (Constitution) it should only be 1 pp/rank base, 2 pp/rank if Range: Ranged. So this description is in error.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 146, Dimensional Control: The 4-D form says:
4-D Form: You can “sidestep” three-dimensional barriers (Insubstantial 3, 15 points) and perceive as if they weren’t there (sight and hearing Penetrate Concealment, 8 points). You also have a greater ability to move 3-D objects; apply points from your Array to Enhanced Strength and Super-Strength.

However, Insubstantial 3 states: “You have no effective Strength, but you are immune to physical damage.” Thus, Enhanced Strength and Super-Strength won’t do any good. Either the power needs to tell you to purchase the Affects Corporeal extra on your Strength, or Insubstantial 3 should be changed to something else, like Super-Movement (Permeate), that gives the same “sidestep barriers” effect without everything else that goes along with Insubstantial.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 148, Dimensional Pocket: The description under the Feedback flaw seems like it should be errata’d to correspond to the core rules version of Feedback in the same way that the current errata for UP changes the Feedback flaw description on Telekinesis (pg 195)

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 157, Fire Control: Under the Melt Alternate Power, it says “Melt: You can generate heat intense enough to melt materials with a Toughness equal to or less than your Fire Control rank. So, for example, Fire Control 10 could generate enough heat to melt steel (Toughness 10), while Fire Control 20 could melt all but the most heat-resistant super-alloys.”

Steve has mentioned that this is an error and should be a normal Drain Toughness effect, presumably Ranged Affects Objects Only Drain Toughness. See viewtopic.php?t=21345

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 157, Force Constructs: The Force Shatter AP has the following description “Force Shatter: By projecting a force field inside an object and expanding it, you can damage its structure, giving you Perception Range Penetrating Damage at half your power rank, Limited to objects.”

It seems like Limited to Objects should be a -1 flaw here, making this power’s cost 3 pp/rank (1 pp for Damage + 2 for Perception-range, +1 for Penetrating, -1 for Limited). So the Force Shatter power should be at two-thirds your Force Constructs power rank.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 161, Gravity Control: At the end of the first paragraph of this power’s description, add the sentence (or something like this) “Gravity Control counts as if it forced a saving throw for power level purposes.”

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 173, Mimic: 1) Change the second and third sentences of this power’s description, from “You can mimic a total of (rank x 5) power points in traits per subject, and no trait can have a bonus or rank greater than your Mimic rank, or the subject’s rank, whichever is lower. So Mimic 8 allows you to mimic up to 40 points in traits, no one of which can have a rank or bonus greater than 8.”

To “You can mimic a total of (ran x 5) power points in traits per subject, and no trait can have a bonus or rank greater than the subject’s rank. So Mimic 8 allows you to mimic up to 40 points in traits.”

Fixed.
Elric wrote:2) Steve has said in at least a couple ORQ posts that Mimic with the Extra Subjects extra gives you 5x rank pp total, not 5x rank pp per subject. For example, see viewtopic.php?t=11322

This directly contradicts the wording of Mimic, both in the core book and Ultimate Power

"You can imitate one (or more) of another character’s traits: abilities, skills, feats, or powers. You can mimic a total of (rank × 5) power points in traits per subject.”

If these rulings of Steve’s are correct, presumably “per subject” should be deleted from Mimic’s description as well.

NOT Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 177, Pain:
The last sentence of this power states, “A save that fails by a greater margin than before increases the power’s effect, as described previously”

What is this referring to? I think this may be a reference to the “accumulating levels of failure” clause from the Nauseate power, but if so, as Pain is based on Stun, this is erroneous and should be deleted.

Not changed.
My take on it was that they were simply indicating (redundantly really) that someone who is dazed is not immune to becoming stunned when they failed by 5 the second time they got hit.
Elric wrote:Pg 180, Plasma Control:
1) The Melt AP for Plasma Control says that “Solid objects reduced below Toughness 0 are melted into puddles of slag.” However, this contradicts a few other places in the rules where it says that objects have a maximum Toughness of -10, e.g., Corrosion in the core rules and Corrosion on page 143 of UP. Steve’s answer here: viewtopic.php?t=21345 indicates that the -10 rule is the correct one, so this should receive errata.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:2) Also, Melt should presumably specify that it is a Ranged Affects Only Objects Toughness Drain effect.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 188, Shape Matter: Since the Transmutation power has a Sustained duration instead of Sustained Lasting by the errata, Shape Matter should presumably have a Sustained duration as well.

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 189, Shield: Change the duration of this power from “Sustained” to “Continuous”

NOT Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 190, Silence: Two problems, perhaps related:
1) The sentence saying “You cannot be heard at all at distances greater than 30 feet” seems incorrect; isn’t the point of the Silence power that you can’t be heard at all from any distance?
2) It looks like the power should cost 2 pp or 4 pp, not 1 pp or 2 pp (and this should also be changed in the table on page 127).

Fixed.
Elric wrote:Pg 197, Time Stop: The No Save Extra on Time Stop should be +2, not +1, as Steve mentions here: viewtopic.php?t=25170

And fixed.

As mentioned above, your phrasing was dead on almost throughout. And almost all of these are in. There's, what, two changes not made, one where they incorrectly applied the errata change (Emotion Control: Calm), and one disputable case with Pain. :) Not bad, really.

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby Paragon » Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:41 am

FuzzyBoots wrote:As mentioned above, your phrasing was dead on almost throughout. And almost all of these are in. There's, what, two changes not made, one where they incorrectly applied the errata change (Emotion Control: Calm), and one disputable case with Pain. :) Not bad, really.


And the Shield/Enhanced Dodge Focus issue, but they simply may have forgotten that one by the time it got around to editing the printing document.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby Elric » Fri Nov 20, 2009 11:34 am

FuzzyBoots wrote:As mentioned above, your phrasing was dead on almost throughout. And almost all of these are in. There's, what, two changes not made, one where they incorrectly applied the errata change (Emotion Control: Calm), and one disputable case with Pain. :) Not bad, really.


Thanks for doing this! Put a smile on my face :D

Also, now that I know that the errors that weren't in the errata were almost all fixed, I can recommend the book more freely.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby FuzzyBoots » Fri Nov 20, 2009 11:38 am

Paragon wrote:
FuzzyBoots wrote:As mentioned above, your phrasing was dead on almost throughout. And almost all of these are in. There's, what, two changes not made, one where they incorrectly applied the errata change (Emotion Control: Calm), and one disputable case with Pain. :) Not bad, really.


And the Shield/Enhanced Dodge Focus issue, but they simply may have forgotten that one by the time it got around to editing the printing document.

Ah... sorry for the ambiguous sentence. Improved version:
There's, what, four cases where they did not change it properly. Two cases where changes were not made, one case where they incorrectly applied the errata change (Emotion Control: Calm), and one disputable case with Pain. :)

There were two items where it was not fixed at all (Shield and Mimic), one where they threw the baby out with the bathwater in the published errata (Emotion Control: Calm and the misplaced text), and a case where they have a confusing sentence which may or may not have been a mistake in their mind (Pain).

Overall, I was pleasantly surprised. I expected the Pocket edition to essentially be a quick reprint of their existing document with mild formatting changes (I know that I should expect higher quality from Green Ronin, but they've admitted financial difficulties, which frequently leads to people cutting corners in an effort to save their business long enough to bring back higher quality). Hmm... which means I need to check my Pocket Players guide to see if they fixed the issue with missing entries in the hampered movement and flight tables...

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby FuzzyBoots » Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:20 pm

As a side note, despite the removal of the limitation on ranks in Variable, Mimic still has that odd line about being able to trade off between maximum ranks and maximum points. Despite there not being a maximum number of ranks.

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby CharlieRock » Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:48 pm

Captain Liberty wrote:Any chance we will see an updated (with errata changes) version of the hardcover UP coming out some time this century?

We can only hope. :wink:

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby slaughterj » Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:26 am

Elric wrote:
slaughterj wrote:
Elric wrote:That said, there are a lot more known errors in UP than are included in the official UP errata.


Like what, and where's the list?


Here are many of the mechanics-related places that deserve errata, in my view, but don't have it yet. GR knows about this list.


Okay, so it looks like the Pocket Ultimate Power fixed nearly all of your list. But you said your list is in addition to known UP errors. So were the known UP errors all also corrected?

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby Elric » Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:49 am

slaughterj wrote:Okay, so it looks like the Pocket Ultimate Power fixed nearly all of your list. But you said your list is in addition to known UP errors. So were the known UP errors all also corrected?


My list was in addition to the official UP errata. If they fixed a bunch of stuff that hadn't yet made it into the official UP errata file, I'd certainly expect that they fixed nearly everything that's in the official errata file.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby slaughterj » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:29 pm

Elric wrote:
slaughterj wrote:Okay, so it looks like the Pocket Ultimate Power fixed nearly all of your list. But you said your list is in addition to known UP errors. So were the known UP errors all also corrected?


My list was in addition to the official UP errata. If they fixed a bunch of stuff that hadn't yet made it into the official UP errata file, I'd certainly expect that they fixed nearly everything that's in the official errata file.


Reasonable enough, but anybody able and willing to do a comparison like done above, but for the official UP errata and fixes in the Pocket Ultimate Power?

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby slaughterj » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:29 pm

Also, for those of us who bought the Ultimate Power PDF, shouldn't we be able to get the Pocket UP PDF free since it's basically the updated version of what we bought?

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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby Elric » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:18 pm

slaughterj wrote:Also, for those of us who bought the Ultimate Power PDF, shouldn't we be able to get the Pocket UP PDF free since it's basically the updated version of what we bought?


There is no "Pocket UP pdf." Hopefully GR will update the UP PDF based on the changes in Pocket UP for those of us who bought the pdf, but it doesn't seem to have happened yet.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby roguescribner » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:20 pm

I don't think Green Ronin is looking to just give away product for free. They don't have such a wide profit margin that they could afford to take the hit. If you have UP, there is errata available for free so you have the latest information. I own the print version of UP and I am also about to purchase the print version of Pocket UP. I would not expect Green Ronin to give it to me for free even though it's smaller and up-to-date.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby Elric » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:04 pm

roguescribner wrote:I don't think Green Ronin is looking to just give away product for free. They don't have such a wide profit margin that they could afford to take the hit. If you have UP, there is errata available for free so you have the latest information. I own the print version of UP and I am also about to purchase the print version of Pocket UP. I would not expect Green Ronin to give it to me for free even though it's smaller and up-to-date.


This is wrong on multiple counts.

1. Many of the items corrected (mentioned by FuzzyBoots above) are not in the UP errata.
2. Green Ronin has updated the core book pdf to the most recent printing multiple times, in direct contrast to what you suggest here. They sensibly have never, say, tried to charge early core book pdf customers for an updated pdf that corrects known errata.
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Re: Pocket Ultimate Power Available

Postby roguescribner » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:23 pm

He wasn't asking for an updated pdf, but a pdf of a separate (but similar) product. There were differences between M&M and Pocket M&M, so I imagine there could be differences between UP and Pocket UP. I don't know, I don't have it yet.

And if GR hasn't updated the errata, well, that's something they should do. Seems like it'd be beneficial to them and the players. Then they wouldn't have to worry about issues such as this. That's what the errata is there for: to update the players with the latest revisions if they purchased an older printing.
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